Watcing O'Reilly Factor. They are discussing whether or not covering Jacksons drug use and trials post death is racist. Lamont HIll of course thinks so but James T. Harris (talk radio host) does not. (Both are African Americans.) They showed a clip from the BET award shows where Jamie Foxx was stating we should be celebrating his life "this BLACK man-he belongs to us". WTF? What kind of talk is that????? Geez. That "racist" remark dropped him a notch in my book. Not wanting to start a race discussion but I just don't understand how remarks like that can fly. Someone said that no one ever talked about Elvis or JFK's troubles when they died. Well DUH, they didn't have the internet and all that stuff going on or they would have! My two sons know Elvis used drugs and how he died. What do people think of when they think of Jerry Garcia? Pot. Or Jmi Hendrix or Janis Joplin? Geez it's a part of their life and death as was Michael Jacksons trial, plastic surgery, etc... Reporting that in the history of his life is a fact, not racism.

I have very strong feelings about this, so I've been trying to stay out of the discussion, but Kathy, you've got me intrigued with this one. I don't see how discussing Michael's problems could be considered racist by anyone. I watched the BET awards last night, and while I understand your point about Jamie Foxx's comment, I don't think he meant it in a racist way. I certainly didn't take it that way. I was six years old when Elvis died, and I remember it pretty vividly, and I heard many people mentioning his drug abuse when talking about his death. As for Jerry Garcia, I'm a little biased being a Deadhead myself. But just so you know, Jerry didn't do too much pot. It wasn't his drug of choice, and yes, drugs contributed to his death too. Most Deadheads I know are open to discussing all aspects of Jerry Garcia's life when talking about him. So I guess I'm still at a lose as to how discussing a dead person's problems can be a racist thing.

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You must not be watching cable news then! lol
I didn't see the whole Jamie Foxx bit just the part that was quoted so it may have been taken out of context to a certain extent. I was just shocked-what if a white person had said that about a famous white person? All hell would break lose! lol About Jerry-I'm not a deadhead but I just associate him with pot. Maybe that's inaccurate but the Garcia fans I know personally enjoy some "recreational use" of the above mentioned substance! lol

Race hasn't even crossed my mind on this matter. I heard Al Sharpton (and I despise him) had something ignorant to say about it, but that's all I've heard. As far as Elvis, my Mom was a fanatic for him, but yet the world and everyone around knew about his drug use and womanizing. Same with JFK.

Yet, we loved all of them , and were all great talents that should have gone on and on, among others.

I am really sad about Michael Jackson. I would've liked to see him make a comeback, and regain his claim to fame. He was a truly talented man ! I think he was highly misunderstood, and lived his life literally under a microscope. I'm sure if I had somebody watching me for my entire life, and my everyday little habits, someone would try and have me committed. At some point I would do something to make people say "Wow, she is a nut job".

I also can't imagine the money he had, and trying to figure out who really cares and who just wants a piece of the pie. He was basically cut off from a normal life before he was even a teenager.
Just my 2 cents.

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I saw Al speak live on tv. He brought race into it within hours of his death. That was very inappropriate to me.
Yes, Michael was extremely talented. He really did have a rather sad life. I cannot imagine growing up the way he did. He was such a sensitive person that it was probably doubly hard. It would have been fun to see him make a comeback. Watching his father speaking out makes me see how weird it would have been growing up with him as a father. I hope he is at peace now.

double post.....

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
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Oh, Brother.

Had a long post here but remembered, it won't make a bit of difference.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

I don't think it's racist. There's a big difference in the way conservatives and liberals perceive the world. I think that conservatives have always shown great disdain for celebrity.

From the time that his death was announced, I noticed that Fox focused on nothing but his alleged drug use and the trials. They never mentioned how he was the first black whose music went mainstream. For Fox, there was a pretty strong assumption of guilt.

I know that the Brit who wrote a biography about Michael said that he went into the research convinced that Michael was guilty of pedophilia and finished convinced that he was innocent. I know that a jury of middle aged white people were convinced that he was innocent. But, Fox implies that he's guilty. There was nothing else to Michael Jackson as far as they were concerned.

As far as Al Sharpton goes, he's been a Civil Rights activist since he was a very young man. That's just how he sees the world. I do not understand why you feel compelled to hate the man. I have seen him in non hostile interviews. He's both funny and astute.

But, go on; watch Fox. USA! USA!

"They never mentioned how he was the first black whose music went mainstream" THATS how race gets brought in... The first black who did this, who did that, who said this, who said that...
Why cant it be that he was an amazing musician?? Not taht I agree with that statement however WHY does the word BLACK have to be anywhere??

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Be careful what you wish for.....

We have a very lengthy history of discrimination in this country. I think that the reason his music went mainstream is that he was such an enormous talent.

Okay, I will try and explain it to you....He was a black man before he was a musician. Therefore he was a black person. He was the first black person whose music went mainstream. It would be silly to say he was the first amazing musician who went mainstream. That doesn't make any sense to me. Does it to you?

Not trying to be snarky to you at all. Just that this is silly. KTS wants this thread to be about race and how her righeous indignation about how race keeps coming up and she is thrilled how this is going to turn out.

MJ was an amazing musician composer, dancer, contributor to the human race. His dream of what the world should be was an amazing one. He was never convicted of being a child molester and in America, you are innocent until proven guilty or don't any of you Fox watchers not believe that? I do because it is how our legal system works.

Some of you do not consider him an amazing musician. You are in the minority, I am afraid. But that is okay. There are enough people out there who consider him to be the best in the world to keep his legacy and memory alive.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

What about Nat King Cole?

(I don't listen much of the Michael Jackson hoopla and I never listen to FOX, so I won't comment on the main topic of this post.)

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I don't think that Nat King Cole is mentioned in this catagory because his music didn't transcend to mainstream radio, TV, pop music etc. I am not sure but I think that is the way it was.

I do remember that MTV wouldn't put black videos on their channel until MJ came along and his popularity couldn't be denied across all races.

I personally love Nat King Cole. But I am not sure he was the pop sensation that MJ was.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

Nat King Cole had his own TV show! He had a number of very popular pop music songs:
Straighten Up and Fly Right, Let's Fall in Love, Route 66, Unforgettable, Mona Lisa, Almost Like Being in Love.

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Okay, you are right. Nat King Cole should be the one mentioned who transcended all races and everyone has it wrong.

I don't know why but I am sure there is a reason that MJackson is known for transcending racial lines in music. I have given all the reasons I have read or think about it.

Michael Jackson was an amazing contributor to music for over 35 years. He will remain the King of Pop and will leave a lasting legacy of his talent for generations.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

Nat King Cole did not have pre-teens crying whenever he sang. He had no little girls (white and black) who slept with his poster over their bed and wanted to marry him so badly.

I guess it's a sex thing.

How do you know? LOL!

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"MJ was an amazing musician composer, dancer, contributor to the human race"
can someone please explain to me how he was a great contributor to the human race?? Composer and dancer I will give you but contributor??

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Be careful what you wish for.....

Jackson donated and raised millions of dollars for beneficial causes through his foundations, charity singles, and support of 39 charities including his Heal the World charity.

Do you remember the song "We are the World"?

I think that would make him a great contributor to the human race. And as a composer and dancer the contributions he gave of his talent in inspiration is evidenced by so many people saying he influenced them to dance, to compose to sing or how to just try and be a better person after hearing the song "Man in the Mirror".

These are just my guesses as to why I think he is a contributor to the human race.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

He was also 500 million in debt...

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Be careful what you wish for.....

Thats exactly what I was thinking! He gave lots of money to many different charities. I loved MJ as I was growing up. I hope he is finally happy and at peace.

USNAMOM, I agree with all your posts in this thread!!

Jen

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SJCC STREAKS FOOTBALL!!
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What does that have to do with any of this?

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SJCC STREAKS FOOTBALL!!
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And.....? Is there a point in there?

People are talking about his contributions in his life to better mankind. No one was speaking about his debt. Because someone is believed to be in debt doesn't really mean they weren't charitable or didn't leave an amazing legacy to the music world.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

[quote=jazame;3273325]What does that have to do with any of this?[/QUOTE. ]


People with debt are worthless as human beings?

[quote=kvmj;3273331]Sure makes it sound that way huh? Thats crazy.

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SJCC STREAKS FOOTBALL!!
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[quote=jazame;3273335]
Not really. It says that the poster is using the time worn "nanny, nanny boo boo" theory where if you say something he/she can't deny is true, they drag out something totally off the subject to try and make their point. Next, we will hear about how he tried to lighten his skin so he can't really be a black entertainer....or maybe we will hear how he has white children so he can't be considered a black entertainer...or maybe this has been a test of the emergency MyCoupons broadcast board. We haven't had one of those in a while.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

[quote=usnamom;3273337]LOL! That's gotta be it!!!

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SJCC STREAKS FOOTBALL!!
CLEVELAND BROWNS FOOTBALL!

I did not say people with Debt are worthless... I do not see how people can say he contributed so much to society...
Are we not bailing out banks because of people with debt?? Was there not just a thread here recently about how people who abused credit and had all this debt screwed up the economy?? Yet he is a hero? I dont get the double standards.

Yes we are the world is a great song and was a great thing however if you read the whole story behind it you can not say he was soley responsible. We Are the World - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And Man in the mirror was not composed by him... so he cant take credit for that!

"The song was composed by Siedah Garrett (who can be heard singing in the background with Jackson) and Glen Ballard. Jackson added background vocals from Garrett, the Winans and the Andrae Crouch Choir, which gave the song its distinctive sound.

Arranged with a gospel choir, a year after David Bowie used the same device for "Underground", from the fantasy film Labyrinth, other popular artists at the time who had tracks featuring gospel choirs include Debbie Gibson, Guns N' Roses and Madonna for her 1989 number one hit "Like a Prayer". Siedah Garrett also sang on Jackson's "I Just Can't Stop Loving You" [1] and was one of the backing vocalists for Madonna's Re-Invention Tour of 2004 and performed a short solo during "Like a Prayer.""

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_in_the_Mirror

If you scroll down you will see who it was written and composed by.

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Be careful what you wish for.....

Dannic, no matter what people say, in your eyes he is not going to be to you what he is to many many people. So, let it go. You again, are in the minority in your thinking that he didn't leave a contribution to humanity and to the entertainment world as well as to the world at large for lots of reasons. He was not only famous, he was infamous. There is a reason he is called the King of Pop. Even if his contributions are just his music, it is a great contribution if it made people happy and there is no doubt that it did.

It seems fairly obvious that the millions of people who are mourning him these last few days are not delusional. He meant something to them. And it wasn't about his debt.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

Agree to disagree....
I think people get caught up in the hype and ride the bandwagon...

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Be careful what you wish for.....

Back to my op-I don't understand why the "black man-he belongs to us" isn't a racist type thing to say. Isn't that separating him by race? Isn't that what African Americans don't like having done? Or is it just ok if they do it? This is a sincere question. As far as entertainment, there have been many, many awesome black entertainers before Michael Jackson. However, with MTV, cable, etc... that opened up a much wider avenue to showcase talent. The list is really endless-James Brown, Nat King Cole, Billie Holiday, Duke Ellington, Ella Fitzgerald (the first black woman to win a grammy in 1958), Louie Armstrong, Chuck Berry, etc.. I'm not trying to downplay racism either. I did write Mr. James Harris, the guy that was on Fox News, and got a nice reply from him.

Think what you want. He had talent and will be missed by millions who recognize that talent and contribution to music and entertainment as well as to humanity.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

I don't know what you're talking about when you say, ""black man-he belongs to us". (Don't watch Fox) I honestly haven't heard that.

I remember the time that he shot to superstardom. He belonged to everybody.

Maybe it's because little girls are attracted to shiny thing. I know that I love glitter.

Of the jazz musicians and singers you mention, yes, they certainly had plenty of white fans. But they were secretive pleasures. Can't say that James Brown didn't exude raw sex from every pore, but soul is distinctively a black genre.

Personally, I'm tired of hearing about Michael Jackson. Funny how all news media ripped him to shreds when he was on trial for molesting children but now they're all sentimental and acting like he was just a wonderful person.

Al Sharpton is an A**. He brings race into everything. As for someone mentioning Fox News, they've talked about Michael Jackson's accomplishments plenty. So much that I turn the channel when they talk about him.

I'm just tired of it. We've had numerous celebrities die this week. It really bothers me that hardly nothing has been said about Farrah. I finally heard that her funeral is today.

Bury Michael Jackson and let him rest in peace.

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"GO HOKIES!"

Right. Mr. Jackson was an AA and he was an entertainer. It seems pretty simple to me for him to be considered an AA entertainer. He belonged to the AA race so if you want to consider Farrah a white woman, she belongs to you, okay. It would be true.

I think what AA do not like and I might be wrong is to be thought of in terms that hold everyone to the same measure. Like if you are AA, you all do whatever.....welfare, bad nieghborhoods, terrible busriding skills, commit crimes, have weird names, etc.....
That is called racism or bigotted behavior to lump everyone of one race together based on a negative stereotype. I do not know what you could possibly be talking about when you posted your op. There was nothing racist about what Jamie Foxx said. But then again, most have a different view of race than some here.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

You forgot the 15 kids. (All to keep welfare going)

It's the truth, though. How many white people do you see in the projects? Around here, not many.....

As for stereotyping, that's everywhere. West Virginia has its stereotype, rednecks have their stereotype, San Francisco has its stereotype. Why do the blacks think they're the only ones? It's just not true.

Jeff Foxworthy has made his fortune making fun of rednecks! I don't see rednecks rioting in the streets because it's 'unfair'!

As long as there are people out there like Al Sharpton, Jamie Foxx and Jesse Jackson, there will be race issues simply because they want it that way.

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"GO HOKIES!"

Pure and simple, this is the worst post I have ever seen here at MyCoupons. You, my dear need to get out more.

1. There are all kinds of white people who live in projects.

2. Calling someone a redneck is not a racist term.

3. There are race issues because there are people who are racist (look in the mirror).

Get ready to reap the storm because all those people who thought you were kind and sweet now know the truth. I used to wonder why you would defend someone who posted the garbage that a poster used to post on the Political Board. I just thought you were posting because you were nice to her. Now, I can guess the real reason. I am not picking on you now. This makes me so sad for you because you feel this way. It is ignorant to feel that only black people live in projects or that racism exists because Al Sharpton or Jesse Jackson or Jamie Foxx (?) keep the issue alive. I am at a loss for words.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

Mom2twins2-welcome to my racist world per usnamom!!!! lol I guess if some famous white entertainer dies and we have a "white" awards show someone can stand up there and say "Let's celebrate this WHITE man-he belongs to us" and usnamom won't be offended!! ha ha ha lol lol lol
Racism will continue even stronger the longer AA's keep helping it continue.

"It's the truth, though. How many white people do you see in the projects? Around here, not many.....

As for stereotyping, that's everywhere. West Virginia has its stereotype, rednecks have their stereotype, San Francisco has its stereotype. Why do the blacks think they're the only ones? It's just not true.

Jeff Foxworthy has made his fortune making fun of rednecks! I don't see rednecks rioting in the streets because it's 'unfaiir"

mom2twins2,
I have to say that i agree and understand COMPLETELY. AA people all the time say that people from West Virginia are rednecks or hillbillies or marry their sisters or whatever.. Oh we are CRACKERS, or HONKEYS or whatever... But mumble the "n" word and riots happen.
However that is not racist?

USANMOM, why do you feel sad because she (or anyone else) feels this way? Perhaps not everyone grew up in the sheltered world that you did...

__________________
Be careful what you wish for.....

You don't get it.

Poor people live in the projects---and the population of the projects is proportionate to the general population of an area (we have very few AAs in Montana, thus our "govt. housing" is generally populated by Whites or Native Americans--the majority of the population)

I disagree that calling someone a "redneck" is not a racist term. Redneck originated w/ WHITE farmers (out in the sun all day, sunburn on the neck hence "redneck"). Redneck has come to be a derogatory term generally applied only to "whites".

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"God is great,
Beer is good, and people are crazy"

LOL! Why am I shocked when three racists bond together....or are they all the same one?

Never will I ever say I am amazed. Kathy, I am not the only one on the Politic board who thinks you are racist. Now I am not the only one on this board either.
Ignorance abounds.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

usnamom I have to agree with all you have said in all your posts. No matter what Micheal Jackson was a legend a icon, a artist, he had so much talent with his voice and his dance moves the list goes on and on. I also know he was human and did have faults and flaws like all of us do. However bottom line is we are average people, we are not in the spotlight for some of the famous people out there all the fame and fortune sadly and mostly hits them hard. I guess I am trying to say for instance when we go to a performance and see the show. We sit day and enjoy the show, but in reality we do not go throught the countless hours and hours and days and nites of all the practicing that goes on behind the scenes. Yes I know all performers and actors are paided very very well indeed, however personally with their hectic schedules ,I would never ever be able to do that. Then we all have to wonder why so many performers full prey to all these prescribed sp.. medications and illegial drugs to keep up with the demands. In the end I will miss Micheal very much and I do personally feel he did have enormous talents, saldy time was not on his side. On a personal note as far as Al Sharpton is concerned, he has been a activist forever, there are some things I feel he is correct but I also feel sometimes he is not right and goes overboard and also there are times, he should remain quiet. This honestly the death of Micheal Jackson should never be a race issue, but I feel it will. So again usnamom I agree with all you said... Peace. Catherine

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Who brought the issue up on MyCoupons? Who always brings race into the issue here on MyCoupons? Thaaats right, folks, KathytheShopper. So, unless she is secretly AA, it isn't AA here keeping the race issue alive here.

This is the stupidest thing I have ever ever witnessed. Shame on all three of you.

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RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother.
Praying for my Marine Son who is deployed somewhere in the sandbox until July, 2008! He's HOME!!!!! God Bless the USA!!!!!

ITA with Nita and Catherine.

I also do not consider the word redneck racist. My SIL is a redneck. My son was a redneck. He was proud of it. To me, and them, being a redneck is a "country boy". Loving the country music, fishing, big trucks, Jeeps, off-roading, camping, etc.

Ignorance abounds...
Touche USANmom....

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Be careful what you wish for.....

Yes, it's true. It must have been. President Obama sent his family a personal condolence letter. Not just any Tom, Dick, or Harry gets one of those from the POTUS.

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Maybe they didn't mention it because it's just not true. I remember dancing in clubs and bars to Ray Charles, Aretha Franklin, Chubby Checkers, Diana Ross and the Supremes and many many more, that I, at the time, considered mainstream. Long before Michael Jackson was a anything more than a remote up and coming very young singer. Someone else mentioned Nat King Cole. I grew up listening to him and The Mills Brothers two of my mom's favorites. There was Harry Belafonte and Mahalia Jackson. Fats Domino and Satchmo. Lena Horne, Little Richard. All the Doo Wop singers. Stevie Wonder.

I loved Ray Charles. Still do.

Michael Jackson was big. He was extremely talented. He was, however, not first.

How many teenagers had to sneak around to listen to the musicians you mentioned? How many teenagers had to covertly buy the music because their parents didn't think the "black" music was appropriate.
I'm seriously astounded that anyone that has any common sense and knowledge of history can't grasp that yes, Michael Jackson was indeed the first black artist to transcend race! Michael Jackson crossed and broke down so many barriers. Many of the singers you mention were very genre specific. The didn't have hits across all the charts--MJ did.

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"God is great,
Beer is good, and people are crazy"

Since I lived during that time, I feel as if I know as much as anyone. Sure in the early fifties there were problems, but by the early sixties, everyone was dancing to and listening on the radio to all those singers. Those barriers in the world of music were pretty close to non-existent by the time Jackson made his first record. True Jackson broke the race barrier on MTV, if you don't count Tina Turner and a few others. Genre specific? Ray Charles was not genre specific and even if he was, the subject is race. Those black artists were played on the radio, (radio had it's own barriers to be broken), by white DJ's and danced to by white and black teens. We bought their records in great numbers, we knew the lyrics, we loved what we heard, just like the people who loved MJ do and did. He didn't transcend race. I'm not sure how anyone can transcend race. You are what you are. He transcended the number of fans, the money to be made, the money to be spent. He made great entertainment. And his type of music was fairly genre specific as well. Great music that will go on forever, but so will most of the artists I listed.