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| The Cafe - 'TC' So? Your daughter wants her belly pierced? Your cat keeps using the couch as a litter box? Your husband taped the Hockey game over your wedding video? Your neighbor has a gnome collection and it makes you mad? Pour yourself a cup of coffee and come on in to The Café! Talk amongst yourselves...discuss, question, reply, or respond to many subjects! |
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There hasn't been much discussion where I live, but I have heard that some parents are going to keep their children home that day. I think it's unpatriotic.
__________________ If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition, and then admit that we just don't want to do it. - Stephen Colbert. |
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I agree, every President has given this type of speech and I think it is an excellent opportunity for students to hear a talented public speaker, along with showing respect to our President, whether or not you agree with his views. I also think it is a wonderful opportunity to discuss your personal views with your children!! We have lively 'discussions' in our house every time any President has given a speech, state of the union address, etc etc. Kids (any many adults!) have to learn to discuss and challenge, but also support their own ideas and opinions in a clear, coherent and respectful manner!!
__________________ "It's not about how much baggage you have, it's about whether or not you can carry your own baggage with grace and dignity." |
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My kids aren't old enough to see the speech yet. I don't have a problem with it as long as it is just a study hard, do well in school, have a good year, etc. type of speech. However, my problem with the speech was where he was wanting the kids to write ideas on how they could help the president, which led me to wonder what else he was including in the speech (seriously, most kids, some as young as kindergarten age don't know and don't care about what is going on in politics, so how are they going to come up with ideas on how to help him without some sort of a lead from him?). Since the idea was first out in the news, that portion has been changed to having the kids write about how they can accomplish their own goals (which seems much more realistic topic of writing for such young kids anyway). It still leaves me wondering what else is in the speech, though. I'll have to save my final judgment for when I can see the copy of the speech, which I believe is due out Monday.
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Further, my children are too young to have a teacher express their personal views in class. And could someone point me to the speeches that Carter, Reagan, Bush #1, Clinton and Bush #2 all made? Let's then do a comparison of the content of those speeches and the content of Obama's peech.
__________________ Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets" |
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I think the papers were supposed to be on how great the president is.... which I find somewhat humorous. I would have to hear the speech first before deciding if I wanted my child to hear it.
__________________ Check out my homepage http://julie.mycoupons.com/ |
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My child is old enough now to form his own opinions and we discuss politics at home, so I don’t really have a problem if he heard the speech. If he were younger, I would want to know what the content was before viewing it. I think the big problem was that assignments were given along with the speech – write a letter to themselves about what they can do to help the president, etc. Some people just don’t trust Obama.
__________________ There are so many colors in the rainbow So many colors in the morning sun So many colors in the flower and I see every one! -Harry Chapin |
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Yeah - what a crime to have young kids think about what they can do for their country. I don't care how young they are, it's never too early for kids to consider that everything isn't about themselves.
__________________ If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition, and then admit that we just don't want to do it. - Stephen Colbert. |
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Here's George H.W. Bush's speech to students: George Bush Presidential Library and Museum :: Public Papers
__________________ If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition, and then admit that we just don't want to do it. - Stephen Colbert. |
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I think this just goes to show that there are many people who do not trust this president. His approval rating has dropped the fastest of any president in such a short time in office. I think parents just don't trust him and what he may say, they don't want his 'influence' on them and then the worksheets afterwards was the final blow. Our local news is talking about it. The Commonwealth of Virginia is one of the states where they're leaving it to local schools to decide whether to air it or not. And then, of course, parents can always opt their children out of hearing him. |
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Again, why the apoplectic response to a presidential speech to schoolchildren? Obama's speech concerns education and who would know better how to keep kids from dropping out? Why not solicit feedback? Bush 41 did. Here's Reagan's From the archives, Ronald Reagan’s 1988 speech to students | GothamSchools It's rather political, but I would not have objected to y child hearing it. I did not see much political in 41's speech. I cannot find any reference to a Bush 43 speech. However, we do know that he actually went into classrooms as did his wife. Michelle also has been going into classrooms. The "controversy" is certainly amongst the most ridiculous. Maybe it's from people who chant, "Yes, we Klan!" |
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| To presume that those of us who aren't exactly "supportive" of Obama speech are racist shows your ignorance and stupidity. My feelings regardinng Obama has nothing to do with the color of his skin, but more to what I perceive as his lack of experience and his inability to focus on one or two projets---he's all over the place, with no clear cut plans. He has great ideas, but no real plans on how to accomplish those goals!
__________________ Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets" |
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I'm somewhat ambivalent. He's the POTUS of our nation, and so generally I think it is acceptable for him to be able to speak to any group of Americans he governs. I do have reservations for several reasons. One of them is that the teachers union is a rather liberal organization and is very supportive of him, by and large. It makes me think the follow-up discussions about whatever he says will be rather tilted. Given his stellar speaking skills and his ability to sell ideas, the fact that the other side won't be presented by him and likely not by many teachers... that's where I have concerns. Back when I taught school, if you asked my students what the #1 problem in the world was, they would have told you it was the destruction of the rainforests. They saw Fern Gully and read their Weekly Readers. They were an impressionable lot. I don't know what's up with the rain forests today, but they must not be in dire crises because we rarely hear them referenced. In fact, I think I read something semi-recently about all the concerns of the 80's being unfounded because the trees have quickly reclaimed areas that were cut down. Anyway... kids are impressionable, and I do hope he doesn't try to sway them politically... but I don't hold out a lot of hope that he'll be entirely apolitical. |
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I refer to the misinformed who accuse the President of trying to subvert their children based on a speech they have not seen. I think that what motivates people to go about armed and with their lips quivering about "death panels", Kenyan birth certificates and other assorted nonsense has everything to do with the color of his skin. It's why more college grads voted for Obama and the trailer park crowd voted McCain. |
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I think if you are one of those crazies that think this is something designed to poison the mind of your child - then keep your kid at home. Better yet...home school your kid. Get a cabin in the woods and you can all work on that manifesto together...call it family bonding. Part of me wants to be shocked by the fanatics response to this....but, I'm not. The same people that called me unpatriotic for criticizing George W. Bush and his cronies actions during his terms.....who's experience was questionable, personal history was scathing at best, and just came across as a plain dumba** most of the time...are now part of this ridiculous gang of drama kings and queens that live for the opportunity to cry wolf (or cry elitist, socialist, communist, illegal immigrant with a plot to destroy our capitalist world that we know of). So, cry all you want. Whine, whine, whine that the POTUS is going to give a speech directed to school children on the benefits of staying in school and the importance of a good eduction (all while the US continues to get spanked in academic achievement by most of the world's other major countries). Don't expect any tissues from me...or other like me.... ....we'll all just sit back and remember the days when you called us "Bad Americans." And while your at it, "ask not what your country can do for you" and "say no to drugs."
__________________ I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up." |
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I can't wrap my brain around what people think the president is going to say to school age kids that could possibly be controversial. I would think the speech would be about: staying in school, studying hard, recycling, conserving energy, staying away from drugs/alcohol, etc. Basic ideas that are the same no matter what political party the speaker is from. But I could be wrong. Maybe the president will get up and encourage kids to drop out, start making meth and wind up in prison. It could happen.
__________________ Jesus SAVES by shopping smartly and using double coupons! |
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__________________ Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets" |
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My personal belief is certain people are afraid their children will see the President is a normal person who cares about their well being. Imagine that! Considering a certain segment of the population has been doing everything in their power to get their children to believe he is a horrible person, the possibility of having their children realize he isn't such a bad guy is a scary concept.
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Actually, nightowl, I think you are absolutely right. I think Obama's people know his poll numbers are in the crapper and they hope they can put him in a venue where he can look like presidential sweetness and light, decide he's a great guy, and rally around his platform. Everything is about politics when you're the president, regardless of party. |
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Did I say that it was? He has an agenda, and it's hit a snag. He needs to do something to make himself look neutral and middle of the road so people will like him again, and then he will have a better chance at getting his way. What better way to accomplish that than to speak to children about something most thinking people agree about. |
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I am going to watch it first to see if I want my child to view it. We can't discuss religion in school so why can we discuss politics? From what I've heard, no one knew about the speech. They didn't want to release it to parents, only to the school. Also, I've heard that the president is going to ask what each student can do for him and how the president influences each student? I think it is just a political campaign for the next few years. If he isn't going to say anything bad, then why so hush hush?
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And my, aren't you being judgmental? Since when is it bad to be living in a trailer park? And since when does being a college grad make you better than someone else? People don't trust Obama... plain and simple. It has nothing to do with where a person lives, what they do for a living or the color of the skin. |
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How do you know he is going to tell kids to stay in school? Yes, I am comparing politics to religion. I didn't vote for Obama so he shouldn't be shoved down my child's throat just to gain more publicity and look better. The high school students will vote when Obama runs again, so yes, kids do vote.
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__________________ I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up." |
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We received a recorded message that said since it is the first day of school teachers might not have time to show it but may show it at another time. I hope they show it. Work hard and stay in school. It is a great message for our children, and I would not have cared it George W Bush had given one. I would never have thought I better keep my children out of school because they may just grow up to become a republican. lol
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A copy of his speech is suppose to be available online sometime today. ETA: Link to Obama's speech http://www.whitehouse.gov/MediaResou...SchoolRemarks/ You can also see the "new version" of the pdf from the DOE worksheet questions/activites. http://www.ed.gov/teachers/how/lessons/prek-6.pdf http://www.ed.gov/teachers/how/lessons/7-12.pdf "Lesson plans sent to schools originally suggested that students write letters to themselves "about what they can do to help the president.... the wording was changed to suggest that students' letters focus on ways to achieve their educational goals" Hey Obama, leave those kids alone | SmallGovTimes.com "It’s one thing for a president to encourage all kids to work hard and stay in school – that’s a reasonable use of the bully pulpit. It’s another thing entirely, however, to have the U.S. Department of Education send detailed instructions to public schools nationwide on how to glorify the president and the presidency, and push them to drive social change." Something else of interest: Eagle Bay Elementary School in Farmington, Utah showed the I Pledge video at a school at an Aug 28 school assembly. YouTube - I Pledge! Last edited by forrestlayne; 09-07-2009 at 01:28 PM. |
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Every time you think the right wing lunatics can't get any crazier, they do. Complaining about the president talking to school children -- seriously nutty. I guess it's to be expected from a group that takes its talking points from the likes of Glenn Beck, Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh.
__________________ Reading is Fundamental. |
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Okay...I wasn't going to say anything, but...he IS our president. He's not someone running for office. I really think he wants to stress the importance of education...period. Some kids won't listen to their folks or even their teacher...so maybe they'll listen to the head of our country. I think it's a positive thing. At the same time, however, I think this is a great lesson in the freedoms of our country. If someone doesn't want to listen or view the video, they don't have to. That wouldn't be an option everywhere! We are very, very blessed.
__________________ If you're not living on the edge, you're wasting space. |
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Your side does not trust Obama, that's true. Your heads have been filled with tales of Kenyan births, hate for his mother and grandparents, Marxism, Socialism, Communism, pulling the plug on Grandma, rationed care, hate for Whitey, concentration camps, he's a Muslim, and, don't forget, he's going to take your guns away! That last lie got a guard at the Holocaust Museum killed. You do not have to like Obama. You should not be praying for his death or showing up armed at Town Halls. You should not attend these meetings for the sole purpose of drowning out conversation. You should notice that the talking heads at Fox started off the year talking about nothing but the DJA as indication of economic gloom and doom. Now that it has recovered, they never mention the stock market. Sorry, but I have never seen a "nice" trailer park. I hope you know that they do exit polls after elections. Sure Blacks voted for Obama; so did Hispanics. But, college grads were overwhelmingly for Obama. The GOP has devolved into old Southern white males who believe that every house needs a gun and that Creationism should be taught to your child in science class while staring at the 10 commandments. |
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What's wrong wtih homeschooling? Plain and simple...politics should not be discussed in school, as religion isn't allowed. Quote:
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Here's an interesting quote - "Write me a letter -- and I'm serious about this one -- write me a letter about ways you can help us achieve our goals. I think you know the address." George Bush, President of the United States. Remarks to Students and Faculty at Alice Deal Junior High School October 1, 1991. The President spoke at 12:15 p.m. in a classroom at the school. His remarks were broadcast live by the Cable News Network, the Public Broadcasting System, the Mutual Broadcasting System, and the NBC radio network. |
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Politics most certainly should be taught in schools right along with civics. Politics certainly has a lot to do with the way this country developed. Far too few people even bother to vote in this country. |
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I agree totally with jvmj. Democracy is politics in our country, and I teach it daily in social studies. Religion is also taught in United States and World history; how can you teach history without either one of them???? Now, voicing your own political and religious views is a different story.
__________________ If you're not living on the edge, you're wasting space. |
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Having said that, I have no problem with my children seeing the speech. I plan to see it as well, and whatever he says will be a spring board for discussion in our household. I think it's ridiculous to keep your child out of school over this. That is ignorant and stupid on so many levels. To those that are against the speech, would you feel the same way if it were John McCain in the White House giving the speech??
__________________ Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing. |
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Some kids aren't fortunate enough to have parents that CARE enough to say "stay in school", so I think it's good when ANYONE tries to pep them up and keep them on the right track. DANG, I was really hoping no one would open this can of worms..... sigh......
__________________ Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing. |
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| I absolutely agree with you about kids that have parents who really don't care, That's probably not as big of an obstacle as peer pressure. It's not uncommon for kids to be ridiculed for doing well academically.
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Why is it always the same people who insist on bringing in the race card |
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I don't know what school you went to, but I went to both private and public school growing up in the late 70's early 80's....and "politics" was part of the program then, just as it is now. In American history we learned about how the two party system was founded, in civics class we learned about the government branches and how the work together, we even had to pass a civics test in my state before we could graduate. In fact, I called my mother who was in school and the 40's and 50's and she said she not only had a picture of the current President hanging in their school halls, but she remembers listening to the President's addresses on the radio in her class room. American History and Civics belongs in the classroom just as much as Math, Science, and Home Ec. As far as religion goes....nice try in making a point, but it so doesn't fly. Religion has no business in public schools. There are many different religious belief systems in this country that are protected by the Constitution. That is why we as a society allow the creation of private schools, allow kids to be home schooled, and provide tax exemption to churches so you can practice freely. The only restriction from the Gov (which is out of respect for society) is that the public systems, through this "sep of church and state" allow those in the minority belief systems not to be dominated and oppressed by any one/two/multiple religious groups. On the other hand, there is ONE Constitution, ONE Judicial System, ONE way to vote, ONE primary system of Government in the US, and it should be our obligation as a society to teach our children how it works, so when they are adults and are of the legal age to vote and have to register for the military, that they understand how to do so and the implications. If you want to teach your child that one "party" is better than the other, than that is your business....and later it will be your adult child's choice on which way he/she votes. They need the tools because they will be the one's that mold society and will take the roles as our future leaders. And frankly, if you are raising your soon to be voting age teenager to be that much of a dolt, that a few minute speech (given by anyone - POTUS, Paris Hilton, their gym teacher, whomever) is going to fundamentally harm them and brainwash them...then you got bigger problems. The only reason these whackadoodles are making an issue out of this is now when President Obama is on the books to make an address in because they are just that....whackadoodles....with nothing better to do. Presidents addressing school age children or First Ladies developing programs that are brought into the class room is not a new concept. It was there when my parents were in school, and when I was in school, and I hope it will be there when my child starts school. I gotta tell you, that picture of Ronald Reagan in my classroom and those Green "Just Say No to Drugs" buttons that we had to wear for a while did very little to decide my political fate over the years. What did make a difference is that I was informed growing up...I was excited about voting when I was 18....and that didn't come about because someone talked trash or hid me away from that "actor guy and his crazy looking wife in the red suit." Get over yourself, or like I said before....stock up on flannel and firewood and get to work on that manifesto.
__________________ I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up." |
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I just read a copy of the speech, honestly I cannot perceive any rational parent feeling threatened by it. I look forward to hearing it, and to my children hearing it, as our president is an excellent speaker. BTW, in the speech, President Obama does not tell children to hold their breath until their parents support national healthcare. It is a very benign yet inspirational and straight forward talk to children about the benefits of participating actively in their education. |
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Just waiting for someone to complain about him saying "God Bless......" Wait for it......wait for it............
__________________ Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing. |
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The fact that conservatives jumped all over this shaking their fists and crying unfair, "hell no, my kids won't go" before they even knew the content of the message just goes to show you how ignorant they are.
__________________ If this is going to be a Christian nation that doesn't help the poor, either we have to pretend that Jesus was just as selfish as we are, or we've got to acknowledge that He commanded us to love the poor and serve the needy without condition, and then admit that we just don't want to do it. - Stephen Colbert. |
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If one is going to discuss evolution in school, then they should discuss creation also, which would bring in the Bible. Since they aren't allowed to discuss religion at public schools, they shouldn't discuss evolution either. But that's a whole other discussion. They should discuss how corrupt politics in America is then!
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Your treatment and regard for Obama is far more irrational than your treatment of Clinton which was pretty darn bad. Were you radicalized during Bush's term to the point that you glom on to any irrational statement or blatant lie told about Obama. How do I overlook the charming Obama currency put out by the Florida GOP decorated with fried chicken and watermelon, the email sent from a Western State depicting a White House lawn planted with watermelon? Why are you showing up with assault rifles at town halls? Why do they carry signs depicting Obama as a monkey? Why is membership up in White Supremacist groups? Why is Glenn Beck and Rep. Bachmann both telling their followers to pick up arms and march on Washington? I think that the answer to my question is simple. Barack Obama is black. All of you may not br racist, but, it's widespread throughout the Republican party. |
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Really? Do you actually think he wrote it himself? His personal people get paid big money to write his speechs for him. So yes, he may be a good "speaker", but he may be a bad "writer". It isn't up to the President to tell our children to stay in school, it's up to the parents. Go bring home our troops if you really want to make a difference! Quote:
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| I have to say that not knowing what the president was going to say in a speech to children did have me worried at first, only because it's a speech going to k-12 and that's a broad spectrum. They weren't planning on releasing the content of the speech at all, and then decided at the end of last week to do it. I would not have held my child out of school, however. Before we knew what the speech was going to be about, I just planned on being there to view the speech with my child's class, that way, if I felt there were things I disagreed with, I could talk with my child and let them know what I disagreed with and why, and also what I agreed with him.
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__________________ I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up." |
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And, if the parents choose not to do this (that is their right) are you OK with that??? Just because a parent SHOULD encourage their child(ren) to stay in school doesen't mean they all do. Have you been in a classroom lately???
__________________ Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing. |
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It would be a good idea to teach about corruption in government. Kids learn about the Teapot Dome scandal, but that's about it. |
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It shouldn't be up to the teachers to have to figure out which of their students are hungry, abused, or homeless--but that task falls to them all the time. I have read what was released as Obama's speech. There's little political stance/platform and more a "pep" talk. My issue was if the President made it mandatory for all students to watch, and if the original lesson plans ("what can you do to help the President?") had been left in place and forced upon students. My other concern was that you were spanning ages of 5 to 18. That's a huge gap--you have to tread ever so carefully. Unfortunately, some parents are falling down on their responsibilities as parents. If our society has any hope, it rests in our children. Our Children need as much "help" and encouragement as they can get in these difficult times!
__________________ Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets" |
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How about the President telling kids how they can help each other, their family, their friends. What they can do to help the homeless and Earth. How about telling them that they shouldn't litter, cuss, or have sex before marriage? How about all that stuff? He mentions nothing about going to college. Some people get their GED. There is nothing wrong with that. There is nothing wrong with homeschooling. He is telling them to stay in school but isn't telling them how staying in school helps them.
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He is addressing students now because most schools are starting up for the new school year now. -- If that is your only problem, then the big mystery is solved. caj ... perhaps you might want to explore the benefits of Valium. Your apparent outrage is really starting to appear really wacky at this point. |
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I am not liberal, I am not republician, I am not democratic. I NEVER said I didn't like Obama. I just think if he really had a good interest in keeing kids in school, then he should have talked to them while he was running for President or when he became President.
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Do you know education was one his main campaign themes? Barack Obama on Education Oh yeah, the "running for President timing" HA HA. That would have gone over really well. "Hey kids, he isn't even President yet, but we're going to let Obama address all the school kids next week." As to "when he became President" -- The last 8 months have been a bit busy, what with two wars and the economy going to pot." Not to mention organizing things with the Dept of Education. And, the timing would have been rediculous. Think of all the crazies then. "OH NO. He isn't even President two months and he is now trying to get to our precious children..." The time to grab anyone is at the beginning of something. The new school year is when the kids start with a clean slate and are all excited. Nothing is going to satisfy you. Let it go. |
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X and no by the way, I don't live in a trailer either so don't assume there either. Guess I could have kept my mouth shut but your comments in this thread are so "out there" I thought someone should bring it to your attention.
__________________ Then Jesus said, "Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest." Matthew 11:28 |
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Nothing satisfies you either huh? LOL. Maybe he should focus on the economy instead of telling kids that he did bad but it was okay though, because he got "many" second chances and look where he is now. Wow children, it's okay to do bad. Hmm, thinking he may should have left that out! He should be talking to college or high school students, not elem or middle. Quote:
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