Since I was told over and over to start another thread since we are talking about the healthcare reform and how much money it will cost us, and it seems no one worries about all the money that has been spent on the war, which should have never started, who is paying , I know we are, but some here seem to think allllll those billions and lost lifes are okay????. So please answer thanks so much. Catherine,

It is not that noone is concerned about the cost of the war. But it was explained to you in depth numerous times the difference re: the expense of the war vs. that of Obamacare.

Just because someone does not agree with obamacare does not mean they don't care about US citizens and their health. It goes deeper than that.

I personally care about our soldiers and the suffering many of them have endured. It is tragic, no doubt. By the way, my son is in the AF and while he is not serving overseas, the possibility is always there and he is ready and willing. It's a horrible thought for me as his mother, but when he joined the military that is what he signed up for, it's why our military exists in the first place. I understand that sometimes war is necessary. Loss of life is not "ok", but it is many times the result of war and wars have been happening since the beginning of time and will always exist. Is it pretty?? Heavens no. It's hideous. Sometimes life is hideous. Reality is ugly.

You cannot accuse others of not caring, or caring less than you just because they disagree with you. Sweeping statements like that are not conducive to healthy discussion of issues.

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Melissa

What about Pres. Obama putting more people in Afghanistan? Is that ok? You keep talking about Iraq, which I agree should not have been started, but fail to mention Afghanistan. Why is that? That war also shouldn't be going on.
Judy

Stupidity combined with ignorance and arrogance is so ugly

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Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.

E. Roosevelt

I had no idea that "billions" of lives had been lost. Can someone clue me in?

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Melissa

Unless I have missed something, we are not currently involved in a war other than the War on Terror, and I don't believe Obama recognizes it as a war. He does not talk about it in those terms and I believe specifically opted to drop that phrase from his vernacular.

We have troops in Iraq and Afghanistan.

The troops in Iraq are coming home in waves and the Iraqi government is taking over completely.

Obama sent more troops into Afghanistan because of its instability. It is home to the Taliban, Al Qaeda, and and a very weak government.

Last time nobody monitored what was happening there, OBL and his network of evil people recruited terrorists.

Then we had 9/11.

Thousands of people died as a result of 9/11.

Those were people who didn't sign up to 'fight' anything. They were just going about their business.

While I abhor the idea of any serviceman being killed in the line of duty, I know that they signed up for the military and said they were willing to lay down their lives for their country. I much prefer times when the mere existence of our strong military works as a deterrent. Unfortunately, our current enemy - Muslim extremists - could care less, because they see reward in going out in a blaze of glory and taking as many innocent infidels as they can along with them.

In World War II, we lost 1,076,245 US soldiers in four years time.

In the War on Terror we have lost 5,554 US soldiers in ten years time.

On 9/11, we lost 2,752 in one day.

Mexico has lost 35,000 citizens in the past four years to drug-related violence.

I am not 'for' war. I think sometimes war must occur to keep the peace. Our current military endeavor has inflicted a much smaller degree of life loss than most of our previous wars.

I do not believe that the government has any business guaranteeing financial benefits to individual citizens. Rights, yes, benefits, no.

I do not like war, but I know that sometimes it is necessary to keep the peace.

One has nothing to do with the other.

My mistake it was mean't to say billions and billions have been spent on the war that started over 10 years ago, however there have been millions killed here and aboard in Iraq, of course so much more millions in Iraq for sure . I am not sure of the exact figure of how many have been killed from America, but you also have to include those who has been permantely disabled from the effects of the war whether physically or mentally. Perhaps it is just me and my personally and I care too much about everyone, and want all to be okay and take care of everyone, perhaps you might say I am too passionate about my beliefs. In any case it is who I am and will continue to care about the war and the total disaster it has caused our country and of course the so many innocent lives in Iraq. Perhaps too I worry about people who cannot afford even the simpliest forms of healthcare, but again it is my nature as a human to care and worry. To Suezz you are just a plain evil mean spirited person and so glad I have a heart a big heart, go on keep jabbing at me with your little rude comments, it must really make you feel better. Catherine

Edited to say another mistake in my last comments billions have been spent on the war and millions have lifes have been lost here on aboard and so many live each day with the either physical or emtiona scars.. Catherine

Approximately 35,000 US soldiers have been seriously injured in the last ten years.

I too am an extremely compassionate person. I think there a few who do not have a certain amount of compassion for others.

So let me ask Catherine, besides ranting here at mc re: your hatred of the war and your love of obamacare, what ACTION does your compassion take? What do you do with all you passion for these issues? What difference are you making??

Are you visiting VA hospitals and cheering up the soldiers you care so passionately about?

Are you intelligently protesting this war that is not even taking place?

Are you providing medical coverage to an oh so needy family?

Do you keep track via our many news outlets what is REALLY happening?

Put your money where your mouth is. People with true, sincere compassion DO SOMETHING.



ets..........Compassion without action is dead and meaningless.

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Melissa

Yes, we all know from our experiences with you here and on other boards what a fine, kind woman you are. And if we couldn't figure it out ourselves, you would indeed tell us.

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Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.

E. Roosevelt

Yep proved my point Suezz just like Kellyjef you are from the other board where those lovely trouble maker ladies are.......... so dearly wish you would stay over there........ you do not like me and come into all my posts , if you do not like me as KJ said then leave me alone , but aha that would be too simple and too nice, something your not capable of..........sadly........Catherine

I know this will be totally lost on an egocentric like yourself, but what the heck.

There are a number of people you call " troublemakers" and those are the same people you attack as not liking you so I guess they go together, but have you ever looked at the situations you have put yourself into....both in the past and on the very threads existing now... and asked yourself why there are so many people who do not like you....by your own admission?

There is no reason for anybody to pass on any thread or stay off the board. As you said yourself it is a free board, yet you alone seem to feel that you can dictate who posts where while you continue to interrupt threads with extraneous comments . You become angry when told to keep to the topic.

I am neither simple nor nice so I do not have to keep to your instructions....but then again neither am I arrogant and ignorant.

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Nobody can make you feel inferior without your consent.

E. Roosevelt

Hey Suezz, Welcome to the Club

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

*sigh*
I don't think anyone thinks that the lives lost and the money spent on the War on Terror is "OK". FWIW--I happen to know a young man who stepped on an IED right before Christmas. He's alive--but they are still trying to get the shrapnel out of him, repair his eardrums, basically "fix" him. NO! I don't think what happened to him and countless others is OK.

However, it's at a point now where we are so entrenched in the situation that pulling out would prove to be even more detrimental than trying to stabilize the area.

BUT---healthcare reform "Obamacare" isn't fully in place, we could back out of it at this point with little difficulty. And maybe/hopefully come up with a better plan!

I don't know if the war should have been started--but, we are there and we have to finish the job that we started.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Oh yes, she can -- and will

Another mean women checking in here - there, I typed it to save you the effort. Alas, to read the numerous posts, there is only ONE person who cares at all about the war and the effects. And, by golly, we've got her right here. How ignorant to think, believe, and spew that you are the only person who cares?

ill, you said please answer and people have and still, you are rude to them. NOT MANY THINK IT'S OK, it's not just you. Get over yourself.

mom is spot on. What HAVE you actually done except typos and whining and spewing and repeating woe is me, woe is me? What have you done?

With your self professed love of Obama, maybe you can get a private consult with him and tell him how the world should be, according to you?

At least you finally started a thread after crapping in so many others while telling them what to post about like you owned mc. Maybe there is a glimmer of hope after all.

dl

I had to take some time to think about all I wanted to say with the last comments. I will start first with the the same ladies, yes the ones who seem to cannot get enough of hurting me in some way on these boards. It is seems like every single time a heated topic is posted and I am in it, the same ladies all jump on top of me. If you do not believe this to be true, take some time and notice all comes into my posts, ladies there are hundreds of members here, not here all the time, however I would say perhaps 50 members that post alot and none of them except you ladies come into these heated posts. Why is that, the answer is quite simple I disagree with your beliefs and you disagree with mine. You simply think I will back down and run away no I will fight for what I believe to be the truth and my personal beliefs, but you ladies can simply not keep your fingers off the key pad when it comes to me Iluvlucy420 and that is the truth. To Kj and Suezz what goes on at the other site is the same that goes on here. I made a thread recently about meeting some famous people, I also made a thread about Dr Martin Luther King and I also made a thread about so tired of all this snow, where were you ladies not one of you posted?????????? How come, you know why not a hot enough topic to make some trouble. Enough about all of you, I literally cannot understand why you continue to jump into my posts?????. Now back to the question what do I do for Veterans or the war, do you really think I would be this compassionate for sympathy and playing games really???. Okay here goes since you asked lets go back to 1975, then to 1978 and finally to 1981. In those years my father was hospitalized 3 times first time for 6 months, second time for 4 months, last time for 6 months again. My father was hospitalized at the New York CityVeterans Hospital in Manhattan New York . My father had been diagnosed with PTSD, from the experiences he dealt with while he served in the Korean War. My father also each time in the hospital was put there because he suffered from a complete nervous breakdown and anxiety and panic attacks. He could not work, which forced my mom to work 2 jobs. While my father was there, we visited him me and my brothers so many times I lost count. Each time and over the cost of being there, we got to meet several other veterans. While my dad made friends so did we. We were able to take them for walks, to talk to them, to listen to them, to offer some support and comfort. I am deeply pleased me and my brothers were able to help our Dad and his friends. To this day I know I will never forget the site of seeing men without their limbs, so many were in wheelchairs, sadly there were many men who did not talk, but rambled on and we would try to talk to them but it was all too obvious their mental state was deeply effected by all the tragic drama they endured. To this day my dad still keeps in touch with 5 men who were hospitalized with them. We have been to their homes and exchange cards and letters and they are grateful for all me and my brothers did for them , which looking back was so little, but in the end it mean't so much that someone even children cared. In addition to that, at the present time with all the wonderful information we can attain from the internet I was able to help my dad locate some of the men with whom he served with in the Korean War. My dad was first stationed at Clovis Air Force Base in New Mexico. Afterwards he was shipped to Korea. I proudly wear my dads dog tags and someday my son will wear them. Over meeting and contecting with his friends with whom he served, we have since in the past 8 years met 4 times, there was 12 men we are down to 9 now, we meet in Washington D.C for 4 days each year varies , most April or May . We have all gone to see the White House, to Arlington National Cemetary, Lincoln Memorial, Grave of the unknown soldier. It is quite fun to hang out with men who knew my father when he was 17-22, there are always so many pictures and I love to hear old stories. I also contribute to send money to the National Disabled Veterans and Korean War and Vietnam War, 10 dollars to each twice a year. I have gotten so many labels and cards and use them all the time. My dad also goes to a support group right here in Northport Ny to the V.A. hospital that is here, I have joined him, both my brothers have and my mom and my children have done so, its a fairly large group that meets every Thrusday to discuss any issues or problems they may have. I have been given the opportunity to talk to many men over the years. Finally my dads congressman Steve Israel a really lovely soft spoken man, recently got together many veterans, from WW1 and WW2 and all wars following, he made boyscouts and girlscouts conduct all the interviews of the men, who were in the video. I went with my dad when the Video was made and then there was a special showing of the video it is in 2 parts. It was really sad to watch this men describe all the sadness they viewed while serving our wonderful country. However when the video was completed and we viewed it, it was more sad to see, my eyes were so filled with tears, to know what these men did for our country and all the horror they witnessed with death all around them. If you like I can google the video and put the website here. So now I sincerely hope all you may know how I feel about wars and what I have done to help all our Veterans, the best is always the get togethers me and my dad share with his ex buddies from the war and his friend Fred and Kenny they own a piece of my heart, for them helped my dad truly through some difficult sad times............Peace and God Bless our Troops..and Keep them safe till they return.... Catherine

What does anything you said, have to do with what you have done to protest the current war?

I know, I know....I'm just a trouble maker, I don't like you, I'm a b*tch, etc.
I couldn't care less whether you back down or stand and fight on this board. I don't care whether I get the "last" word...

It's not personal, ILL. It truly isn't. I just can't stand the drivel you spout (in usually unintelligible grammar...)

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

One big difference that I see with the examples that you give is in those conflicts and wars the draft was enacted and not all of the soldiers "willingly" served their country. They did because they felt that it was their duty.

As far as I know, while males do have to sign up for the selective service when they turn 18, none have been called and "have to" serve as a result of the draft.

Now as to the cost of the the peace keeping efforts, when do you say I'm sorry but we are not going to spend any more to keep the country safe. We are going to go home and in 6 months send over the terrorists.

The cost is more than the money for the troops to be overseas to protect our freedoms. We are paying more all the time in giving up sense of security and peace as evidenced by all of the security measures to fly. If 9/11 had not happened there is no way there would be all of the security measures in place at the airports. Could you imagine what we would be going through everyday if the troops were not over in the mid-east? Frankly, I don't want to.

I personally don't think that it is a Repulican or Democrat "thing" to finance war or peacekeeping measures. Presidents from both political parties have initiated peacekeeping measures or war.

Right back at ya Marilyn nothing personal I can't stand anything you say either...I dearly tried I was sincere when you were going through your divorce and offered some kind words, however I would never take them back, I am not mean sprited as you are, like how you continue to talk about my grammar, very old news, but make no mistake, there will never be no kinds words to offer you ever. At this point Marilyn I opened up my heart and soul in that last thread and still you come back with those comments, somethings and some people never change.............Would you like me to join the Arm Forces would that then make you happy??? probably not.........sadly......Catherine

But WHAT have you done in regards to this war?
WHAT?
You talk the talk, but you don't walk the walk.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Marilyn this is a fair warning I am done with you, and will never ever ever in this life time answer any more questions or comments you have made about me . Done. Now go pick on someone else and have fun. Done.

It was a simple question! You know that in answering the question, you will prove that you are all talk and no action!

"fair warning"?? MUWHAHAHAHAHA---thanks for the warning.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

I would really just like to say that I could care less about which famous person you have met or anyone else for that matter. I am totally not interested so I would not comment on a thread like that.

I DON"T follow you around. I will post on threads that I am interested in, and I bet that goes for many here. IT IS NOT ABOUT YOU Catherine. If you finally realized that you would be a much more content person.


My mother used to tell me when I was a self centered teenager........"Other people don't think as much about you and you do." iow...........I was always worrying about me and what others thought of me...........guess what? they weren't.

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Melissa

I was thinking the same thing. I read thru ILL's reply above, and tried very hard to see "Now back to the question what do I do for Veterans or the war," and honestly, can not find anything other than how you visited your Dad in the VA hospital, and struck up a friendship with some of his buddies .

I think what Marilyn (and some others) are wanting to know is how you do anything in regards to the current war. If I am mistaken, I hope they will chime in to correct me.

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Lucy,

The situation you describe is horribly sad. I don't think anyone would disagree.

But for me, the thing that sticks out is that you said:

They did it *for* our country.

Sometimes, sadly, for nations to remain safe, people have to go to war for them.

Sorry Wow but your wrong, it is not terribly sad, these ladies still think it is a joke a huge joke. I know sadly that to make our country safe that war has to happen, I just guess I wish we could all get along and be nice and not have to go to war that is all. I do not like wars never will, but to keep hearing rude comments why wow why does it continue, this is not mean't for you wow not at all. Why can I not have a different view and not be ripped apart???. I know what I have lived with , with my dad and what he has experienced, one of the major issues for my dad was, one night while he was on the night duty on the base. Other civilians carried over a 17 year boy that was shot in the head point blank. It was my dad's responsibilty to watch over this young man for a long period of time. I cannot even imagine how that would effect anyone. Thanks though wow for the kind open words in your last post concerning this issue... Catherine

WHO thinks war is a joke??? WHO??? War is not funny in any way. Having a Pollyanna world view is juvenile and useless. Don't we all wish everyone could just get along? But it is simply not reality, nor is it a joke.

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Melissa

Well Melissa you read what I wrote in that very long post, yet you and 2 others came back with rude and nasty comments. So who is joking does it truly make you happy to continue to jump on the band wagon and continue to spew nasty and rude comments over and over. Why did Wowitsdark come back to me and say it was terribly sad, no you had to be like the others rude and honestly really not nice. And before you go there and say oh poor little Catherine, you do not need to. I am not looking for sympathy.

Catherine, I'm going to be straight up with you here.

Nobody thinks war is a joke. Nobody likes it. We have been over this a thousand times.

When you post, you flippantly make comments baiting people and saying they think it is a joke and that they do not care.

That is terribly mean-spirited of you. What on earth makes you think they don't CARE?

I have had to send my kids into the operating room for things that could have killed them. Did I LIKE it? NO! I hated it! But did I recognize that they NEEDED to go? I certainly did.

Did that mean I didn't *care*?

Seriously - you need to lay off telling people they don't care when clearly, they do. It's insulting.

My father served his country too, and kept up with the men that made it back. I have known many Veterans over the years and that seems to be par for course, So from reading what you do for our veterans, all I see besides what all normal veterans and families do, is that you send $20 a year? I would have thought from all you have to say here you would be writing you Congressman and Representative.

Have you ever gone back and re-read what you have written here? I am NOT talking about the spelling and grammar! I mean REALLY read what you have posted? You get all bent outta shape when someone criticizes you, but some of the responses you have made to some of these ladies leaves me scratching my head.

That is something I can't fathom.

When causes mean a lot to me, I spend crazy amounts of time on them. I do contribute financially to organizations, but really feel better about direct financial help to the one who needs it. Maybe that's what she means? That she gives lots directly to individual veterans, and also gives $20 to an organization that also helps them?

$20 just doesn't seem like much for a cause one believes in so strongly, especially given the vacations to the islands, etc., that have been discussed here.

Seriously Wowitsdark I am being mean spirited and I am being insulting seriously from all these posts from all these years???????? you have got to be kidding. I am now being straight up with you, the insults about me to being a immigrant to my grammar, to my winning to my spew of hate and the constant picking on me on every heated argument, I could go back to truble2301 when I started with my belief that being a alcoholic is not a illness. All because I have a different view and all because you all try your hardest to make me have different beliefs???????????. No wowitsdark your now being mean spirited, I honestly and truly thought you were better then them and would not lower your standards to them. Oh boy was I ever wrong, I am the one who peached peace and believe with my whole heart in peace, this place is not peaceful at all. You see in the end, for me at least, I know I am the one on the outside of the group, but that is okay,because I am me and you are you, but Wowitsdark that last list of comments were truly mean -spirited and I am dearly suprised and again because I will not conform to your and others beliefs, cannot anyone else stand on their own 2 two feet and have a different view at the same time without being ripped apart..............Wow I was raised to believe there is good in all people not here at all...............

I did not comment on your points regarding what you think you have done for the veterans of this war, which I think is what the point was supposed to be because according to you you have done nothing. You made some friends because of your personal situation. That is not really going out of your way and making a difference selflessly. That is responding to a personal situation which is typical human behavior.

I didn't think I was being mean and nasty by responding to the portion of the post I wanted to respond to.

Others had already made the points I would have regarding your service, so I felt no need to drive the point home by repeating what they had already said.

I only get involved in threads that interest me....is that ok? Or do I have to post on everything here just to be fair?

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Melissa

Wrong Melissa and a liar straight out liar, you know what you are doing, is it not lovely to be back in highschool, like you and other trouble makers pretend to be, pick , pick , pick, rude , rude, rude. Sure you can come into any thread you like, its your choice, but funny how the same ladies you, Marilyn and Dl are in the same heated ones concerning me over and over and over, you just cannot get enough of me......shame on you..liar. Catherine

Catherine, please re-read what I wrote.

I did not say anything mean.

Yes, I agree - you do have a posse of ladies who are not fond of you and you all bait each other right and left. They do look for every opportunity to zing you and don't give you 'passes' when they would give others passes for having done the same thing.

It's because you have a *history* with them.

But what I am saying to you is that there are a handful of us here that are sincerely trying to get to the bottom of your positions. And rather than articulate them to us, you repeatedly go into a mode of saying how we do not care about the war, how we are *for* war, who we don't care about the veterans, etc.

It's a poor discussion tactic. There is no depth behind it. If you have a position, give us some facts as to why you do not believe we should be in Afghanistan.

I often wish we could run parallel universes and see what would have happened if we had not taken turns we took. If we hadn't invaded Afghanistan and gone after Osama Bin Laden - if we had just let him hang out there with no opposition - how many more bombings would have happened??? We'll never know, because our military did what the military is supposed to do: KEPT US SAFE!! I hate that they *had* to do that, but I don't know of any other way.

Do you? What WOULD you have had us do? Forget Iraq - we're getting out of there. The *continuing* presence will be in Afghanistan, and you are not *for* it.

So I ask you honestly: What do you believe would have happened if we had never entered Afghanistan? Would we have been treated to a national tragedy EVERY 9/11???

The title of this very post asks who is paying for the war. The response is obvious - WE are paying for the war.

You have issues that have nothing to do with me. You are wrong, I am not a liar.

These threads are not concerning "you" they are concerning issues that I care about. You just happen to be making ridiculous statements in threads I enter, that's all. I really is not about you. Although you like it to be.

I will admit that you do make some things more interesting, but for the most part it's just frustrating to try and have a reasonable discussion with someone who is unreasonable.


I will repeat........I could care freaking less who your favorite actor or singer is. Or which famous people you have met. I don't care who collects what. There are many posts you start I am simply not interested in......so I don't comment.

Healthcare, the war........even wedding threads....I am interested in. My interests have NOTHING to do with you.

__________________
Melissa

Wow, to Wowitdark finally you admit that these ladies do what they do to me over and over, thanks so much for that confirmation I dearly and sincerely appreciate that. Now back to the op me, I have already said why I feel this war should have never started, it was not the country who invaded and caused total destruction on 9/11. If I knew that we would enter a war to rid ourselves of Osama Bid Laden and what he did I would say perhaps go for it, but then more bloodshed would happen. Then I feel more harm would come to us in this country for they would be so angry for starting a war in their country. The fact is Bid Laden has not been found, never know if he ever will be, do not even know if he is still alive. I believe he has so much power and money he is still alive, but again no one knows for sure. Again I am just truly worried for our country when we do retrieve all our troops, how it will all play out and what will happen to our country. I cannot even imagine another war. On a personal note while I totally believe we should help every walk of life, all men created equal, I firmly believe we need to mend and take care of our country first, really one one cares about us, the way we care about other countries sadly......Catherine

I am the same way, Melissa.

I don't collect anything. I am tired of our cold weather, but spring is about 7 weeks away. It's winter, it's cold... 'nuff said.

I really don't watch much tv and rarely go to the movies. I just am not into pop culture. I think most stars lead very self-centered lives, and that really does not impress me.

I pay attention to the news. I watch Fox a lot because they ask the questions I used to always ask in my head but reporters never asked.

I watched CNN for the first time in a long time the other night and was blown away by how nasty that Solidad O'WhatsHerName was. Wow. Talk about RHETORIC? I seriously hadn't heard that kind of vitriol from someone who was claiming to be a 'just the facts' chick. What an embarrassment she is. No wonder Gretta, etc., jumped ship from CNN....

Catherine, I disagree that I am 'finally admitting' anything. I'm not involved in the altercations you have with the others. I have not gone back to count posts, but shooting from the hip I'd say that for every one post one of them makes, you make about three. You are not the victim here. You egg them on.

We DID enter Afghanistan to get OBL, and Bush stupidly - or slyly - held back the invasion - and we can thank liberals for that - and in the meantime, OBL headed for the hills in Pakistan.

Let me re-phrase that.

Bush reacted quickly, but not as quickly as he could have. His delay of about one day, if I remember correctly, was just the amount of time it took OBL to vacate Afghanistan.

We reportedly already had special ops people on the ground there.

My theory is that we wanted OBL to get away.

We needed to invade Afghanistan because the Taliban had overthrown the Afghan government, and they were allowing Al-Qaida to have terrorist training camps in Afghanistan - camps that were training Muslim extremists SPECIFICALLY to do harm to the US.

We HAD to take that network down or there were going to be many, many more 9/11's.

It was also known that there were a number of sleeper cells around the world, and that news of OBL's death would have set into motion some of their plans. It would have been the 'go' signal for them to murder many innocent civillians.

So I think we let him have a little bit of time to escape, and that our special ops people followed him and that we have known where he is the entire time. I think he is more valuable to us alive than dead, because if we can track his communications we can find his 'people'... like spokes in a wheel, and he is in the middle.

But regardless of whether he is alive or dead, we needed to prevent the Taliban and Al-Q from having free reign in Afghanistan, for our own protection.

And we are still there today, because even after all this time it is not a stable place.

And Obama gets this and has sent in more troops.

Catherine, do you watch a lot of news shows or read a lot of online news sources? Not just ones that you will agree with, but ones that give you a full set of facts? While my tv news is Fox, my print news (via the web) runs the gamut.

I don't just base my feelings about *this* military conflict based on some *general* belief about war. I think *this* conflict absolutely had to be fought because of the facts of the matter. Absolutely.

Omg did anyone not read where I wrote how when we were younger me and my broithers spend alot of time at the VA hospital where our father was and while he there we became friends and visited many of the other patients as well . Remember I was 13 when this first happened to my dad and ended when I was 19. Did anyone not read the part, where we read to them, talked to them and kept them company. Did anyone not read where I wrote about going to my fathers group therapy sessions and sitting in on them and listening and offering any help I could. Did anyone not read the part about me helping my dad reconnect with his war buddies and that we have gotten together several times and have shared laughs and sorrow and visited Washington D>C and all the important historic places and also that I personally kept in touch with this servicemen who were right along side my dad during the Korean War. Did anyone not read how I was present when my dads congressman Steve Israel make the videos about all the interviews with all our servicemen from ww1 to the current war. Yet from that whole thread, all of you only took away and noticed that I send some money to support the cause for a donation to some of the wars, can you truly be that mean to me.....I give up , how much more do you want from me, is that the best you can do, is remember my amount of money I donate, not the fact that I have opened my heart and soul to these men and have become their friends and listen to them talk ..... Sheesh you really know how to truly hurt someone honestly and sincerely crying now......you have made me feel so low. Catherine

Catherine, I am sorry you feel low. But step back for a minute. Just take a deep breath.

Those are all good things, and it is understandable that you would become close to the people who are directly connected to your father's history.

But your posts have been about how you are against this war, against the money being spent on this war, etc.

Your personal feelings about victims of past wars are not in question. The thing that I (and others, I guess) do not understand is what you are doing about *this* war that you are against.

Your personal stories are nice and they are heartwarming. They just were not really an answer to the question I think was being asked.

Did you know anyone personally effected by 9/11? If you thought our citizens were going to become targets like that repeatedly, would you agree that war to prevent that might be necessary?

I assume that those who were present and survived the WTC attacks also have horrible stories to recount, and those of us who thought invading Afghanistan was the only viable option to keep us safe didn't want our nation to be full of civilians who were at risk every day they just got up and went to work.

Okay wowitsdark what should I do about this war, there is nothing to do, it been set in motion for 10 years little old me is not going to change anything. I simply have to bare and grin it till it is over, but will it ever be over I fear not...Catherine

Do you at all agree that if we had not moved into Afghanistan that we would have been sitting ducks?

In answer to your question somewhat... catherine

Yes Catherine, that was all I took from your post. I don't see that you have done anything more than anyone with a Veteran in their family. I hate war as much as anyone else, my father was a Veteran, my Uncle had a nervous breakdown after his third tour in Vietnam, and my nephew is currently doing his FOURTH tour.

I would have assumed that someone that is as outspoken as you against the war would be sending non stop streams of letters and emails to anyone in politics that you can find an address.

Odd how you demand that people come back and answer a question you have, but rarely come back and answer a valid question posed to you.

I hope you'll understand, then, why it is hurtful for you to say that people who do not hold your beliefs don't care about the war or the money it costs or the soldiers. When you say those things, you anger people because you have insulted their character. Then they go after you with both barrels.

We care about all of those things. We just believed that the alternative was an even bigger threat.

According to the Kansas City Star:

2752 deaths occurred as a result of the WTC bombing. 6,291 people received treatment for injuries.

In one day, Al-Q killed half as many humans as have died in the ten years we have been in Afghanistan.

I don't want our civilians or our soldiers to do. I care about all of them.

And to you Saw how odd it is to decide about the level of what I have done to help veterans , sorry what happened to your family, but you have no right to decide how much help I have done and it is normal, normal perhaps to you and that is your view, not mine. Thanks for the confidence and assurance that I had seemed I did in what I view God would love to help and support and offer love and care for our soldiers, I thought that was really nice and a deed God would admire, sorry I feel short in your belief, Catherine

She did not say you did not do enough. She said that you nothing more than what would be typical of someone personally effected. That's all. What you did is wonderful. But again, has nothing whatsoever to do with the war that we were currently engaged in.

Being so against what has happened in the middle east, and being so extremely compassionate re: what has happened to our soldiers, what have you done to put action to your compassion?? That was the question.

Little old you could do plenty. Maybe not to end the conflicts we are engaged in at the present time, but certainly to make an impact on the lives of the soldiers you feel such a great amount of compassion for.

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Melissa