This is interesting. He begins by saying the celebrations in the US were shameful, and then really slams us for the burial at sea. IMHO... one can't win for trying. Regardless of what the US does, someone from somewhere won't like it. It makes me think it's really pointless, by and large, to try to do things a certain way specifically so we can find favor with foreign nations.

How secretive and shabby the Americans are - The Drum Opinion (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

I agree---when it comes to other countries, we're damned if we do or damned if we don't!
Hence why I think we should maybe focus a little more on our own housekeeping!

(and the OP ED piece does have some interesting points)

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Did we really want his grave to become a shrine of martyrdom, feeding the fervor and hatred that he espoused? A focal point for the building of more craziness and more attempts to kill us all? I don't agree with Obama on a lot of things but the burial at sea was the best of a bad few choices. I admit, I haven't been paying a lot of attention to the after stories, but I've heard that he was armed, I've heard that he was trying to get to guns, and that he was unarmed. Which is true? Does it really matter? He's responsible for thousands of deaths, he got what he deserved. In fact maybe better than he deserved.

Well, I question the quickness of his burial and that fact that if there are ever any questions that would need forensics to answer there is no body. Too darn fast getting rid of the body and why the 45 minutes Muslin ceremony? I'm assuming that pretty soon there will be conspirists (sp) saying it's because Obama really is a Muslim and therefore wanted a proper burial. You KNOW that's going to come up at some point! At first I was like "yippee", we got him and now he's dead and buried but the more I think about it the more it bothers me.
From the news I've watched I think he was unarmed. It's also reported that he was asked to surrender and refused so, if that's the case, it was proper to shoot him.

Well perhaps they took and retained blood samples, etc. I haven't heard that, but like I said I'm not really paying much attention. I think with the burial they were trying to show the Muslim community that his body was treated with respect. And if it weren't the burial to complain about, it would be something else that "comes" up.

I voted for Obama, but I haven't liked a lot of what he has done. But this took guts and if perhaps there was a slight stumble in execution, then I can forget that and take joy in the fact that this despicable man no longer breathes the same air as I do.

We, as Americans, have in the past, and would in the future demand repatriation of our dead. We expect it.

I would have expected us to release his remains to his family so they could mourn and decide final disposition. I do not think it is (was) for us to decide for his family and take that snall amount of human respect away.

dl

dl, I disagree.

I think that sometimes people do things so heinous that they forfeit their right to any amount of respect.

Here, what had to be weighed, IMHO, were the ability to just have it be finished, or to let his death be the beginning of a protracted international burial spectacle.

Saddam was a figurehead for Iraq and Iraq alone, and he wasn't all that loved within his own nation.

Bin Laden was an nationless figurehead of an international terrorist organization. His tentacles reached past our own shores. His death had the potential to fuel all sorts of emotions, and I believe the public image of his family and followers at his gravesite would have compounded things a thousand times over.

Then again... I also think it's very possible that he is actually in a freezer somewhere.

If I was REALLY a conspiracy theorist, I'd think that he has been dead for many years, and that six years ago we built that house in Pakistan as part of a 'cover story' for a time that it would become convenient date for the world to think he had been killed. lol

wow, respectfully....I also think that people in other countries may think or say the same about us / equate Pres. Obama on the same level as obl.

We fiercely believe in knowing the truth, having freedom, treating others with respect, etc. I think "they" (pick your country) fiercely believe the same of us....that we are in the wrong and that they know the truth, etc.

I like your conspiracy theory, but still say we had no right to dispose of him.

dl

I hope they did take blood and/dna samples. That would answer most of any questions I could come up. Maybe they even taped it all!

I'm impressed that Obama authorized this mission. It was quite the risk.

didn't they say they did DNA testing and came up witha 99.9% match with OBL??? Also, the SEALs wear helmet mounted cameras, so a lot of it was filmed. Not for the viewing of the general public, of course. Also, the burial at sea, on the USS Carl Vinson, was filmed. Give it time, I'm sure we will all soon know someone who knows someone, who talked to someone who saw someone who overheard someone that knows someone that knows one of the SEALs....(trust me, people all want to be a part of things like this. LOL) and the stories will only get wilder.

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

When I saw the people in DC the night of Pres. Obama's announcement, I didn't feel quite right seeing that. I was glad OBL was gone, but, why celebrate a death? Like was stated in another thread, we were doing the same thing that disgusted us when we saw people cheering the downing of the Twin Towers, and all of those deaths. While OBL was a terrible person, I just can't quite "celebrate" a person's death. The more I think about it, I agree that we (the US) had no right to bury OBL.

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Good points! Now that you mention it I remember the DNA testing. Thanks for the additional info!

From my POV, it was just cleaner to bury him at sea. This may sound strange, but I think it probably saved some lives. I can't imagine him being buried anywhere without some altercation of some sort happening - a stampede of people running through the streets, etc.

I think we really *had* to take his body from the scene. I realize a swab is good enough for the DNA testing, but I heard someone saying that it is likely that dental and other records were used, which would mean they'd need to do an x-ray or two.

Once we had his body in our possession, the whole process of returning it gets very muddy, IMHO. He had... how many wives? Four? And they did not all live with him, so which of them would get to make the call? His biological family had disowned him. I believe Saudi Arabia had, as well. He was living in Pakistan, but he was not Pakistani. At one time he might have been considered a citizen of Afghanistan, but they have essentially become a new nation with a new government since he left and the Taliban were overthrown. Nobody from Al Qaeda (sp?) would have come forward to claim him because by their very nature, they are a secret organization. They don't even have a 'contact person'.

Say we had returned him to one of his wives. Who would handle the security details for them? Who would have paid for it? Haven't we frozen his assets? What nation would have allowed that return to happen on their soil, knowing the violence and uprisings that would've ensued?

The war of words would be over who had rights to him, who wanted him, who didn't want him, and no doubt if we made a decision to give him to someone that another entity / agency considered to be the wrong recipient(s), we'd find ourselves in the line of fire of some very bad people.

If his body were in our possession *today* we'd be seeing interview after interview between debating factions who all had opinions about what our next step would be, who had the right to him, concerns that we were doing something to his body that was in violation of his religion while it was in our possession... I just think it would have been a disaster.

Every day, somebody dies and the family doesn't get to determine how the remains are handled. Boats sink and bodies are never recovered. Hikers are lost in the wilderness and die in avalanches and are never heard from again. People go to work in metropolitan office buildings and ....

I just think the spectacle and debate that the return of this nationless man would have created would have resulted in more hatred and more death, and we had the opportunity to just stop it cold by making the decision to irreversibly deal with his body and walk away.

I'm no Obama fan - not by any stretch of the word - but I think this was a good call.

So far as far as Obama is concerned he has done the right things concerning the whole ordeal with Osama Bin Laden, for me personally this man did not deserve anything, he to me was not human just like Hitler and Saddam and so many other evil things, they to be are not human. Sorry but his family did not deserve to be apart of any mourning or funeral or whatever they do, more then 3.000 people lost their lives because of Osama, no peace or blessings here and bottom line I sincerely fear what will happen, these people hate Americans... Catherine

Once he was killed, he should have been left there. We never had him "in our possession" until we left with his remains - we chose to do that. It was not our right to take him, period. It also isn't our problem, much less our decision, who pays, who decides, the form of dispostion, etc.

There was a body, and thus there is no merit in mentioning extreme instances where the remains are unrecoverable. That is a non-issue in this case.

We had no right and that is a shame on us in how we conducted ourselves. The next time we demand repatriation, we may not get it. Oh we will expect it and demand it. We already have in the past. And yet we did this. The act was wrong, plain and simple.

dl

How angry/upset would the Confederacy have been if the Union soldiers had killed Robert E. Lee and then buried his body?

*shrug* I don't know. I see both sides of the situation. I think though that I'm of the opinion that OBL's body should have been allowed to be claimed by his family. It's what *we* would expect if the situation were reversed.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Well they are still pissed anyway so I'm not sure it would have made much difference in the long run.

Dl I kinda understand what you are saying, but listen to this when all those people were killed on 9/11 here in NYC, the Pentagon, and the plane that fell to the ground, many many relatives of these people never got a body back to mourn. In fact you may google his name Raymond Downing Jr of Deer Park New York he has been my parents neighbor for years. He was the head chief of operations and was one of the first on the scene. It was only 2 weeks before they were going to call off the search on gathering bodies or parts. All his big family , wife Rose, six children his sons are all fireman, 14 grandchildre. All they received was one of his toes.....How truly sad, so why in the world do we has Americans own these people anything, he was a monster and got what he deserved, however for me it was not enough........Peace and blessings to our soldiers and to all whom lost their lives on 9/11...Catherine

lucy. Because we put ourselves out there to hold such "high" standards whether it is this issue or others as "leaders". We put ourselves out there for right vs. wrong, for freedom, for choice, etc.

Then, we turn around and do exactly what we should not, or would not accept from another nation. Occasionally, we still have mia Vietnam veterans' remains found and brought back to the USA. We expect and demand that to happen. I bet their citizens could care less and for many of the reasons you state about 911. Remember we invaded them, just like obl invaded us. The hurt and offense is there.

Also. Our government infringes on many aspects of our life already. This is one more step to taking away legal next of kin statutes here. If our government can't honor and recognize a family's right to grieve and decide final disposition, we've lost one of the most basic human emotions and rights.

Remember. All "we" had to do once he was killed, was leave him there. We did not have the right to take his remains.

dl

Would the Geneva Convention pertain to OBL???

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

I don't know, aia.

Of what nation was he a citizen?

And I say we could not leave such a radicalizing force as his body would have been, there to be turned unto a rallying cry for more destruction. People can mourn without a body. They know he's dead. He gave up those rights when he became a terrorist.

As far as our "high' standards slipping go, we went down that road a while back with out of country prisons and relaxing our torture standards. Not to mention wire-tapping of everyone, renditions, and holding people without trial. I find most of those more egregious than dumping a murdering terrorist's body into the ocean after giving him a funeral.

Now there is no one spot where the crazy elements that seem to spring up in that part of the world can go to and pray and pound their heads and breasts and continue to feed their need for a way to destroy us. His body will not be put on display and used for eons to come as a focal point for their hatred.

I also feel that if the body had been left there, you same people would be complaining that it was left there.

wildwood, I don't know why I feel this way since obviously the body is gone now and there is no proof that it was him that we have all 'seen', but if all we had taken was DNA and some photographs (that would have had to be shown) and then gotten out of there, leaving him to the Pakistani's, who is to say that their military forces (who were a stones throw away) would not have rushed in, removed his body, killed all the other inhabitants of the home, and then claimed that UBL had not been in there... and concealed the identity of the rest of the people there?

And who is to say that the Pakistanis might have placed his head on a pike and driven through the town celebrating. We can "what if" all day long. No matter what course was taken, there would be people saying, 1. that it was wrong, 2. that it didn't really happen, 3, why didn't you do this instead?

They had a plan, one that in general I think I agree with, they followed the plan, and other than a mishap with a helicopter, it all went well. We destroyed the biggest terrorist in recent years, lost no one in the process, we have lots of papers and computer stuff to give our intelligence people something to do for quite a while and we pissed off the Pakistanis, not a bad day's work.