Take a deep breath and relax.......I know this can be a touchy subject sometimes.....people like to get heated up. I just wanted to know what you guys do in your own family.

My husband and I believe in the power of a swat on the backside every now and again. Don't get me wrong you won't see me slamming my kids at Wal-mart or anything (and lets face it we've all seen that woman).....but we do feel that sometimes in life punishment hurts and the sooner you learn that the easier life is. We are a very Law and Order kinda family. We NEVER spank in anger and sometimes have to wait to spank because we are upset.

What do you guys do.....and if you don't spank, how do you punish your kids?

I don't have kids yet, but when I do, I'll definitely spank. My husband and I have already come up with a few guidelines:

-only for predetermined specific behaviors (outright defiance, physical violence, for example)
-always in the same place (for example, our bedroom)
-ONLY with a paddle made for that purpose (friends of ours actually had their children decorate their paddle
-first, we have to give ourselves a 5- or 10- minute "time out" (or however long is necessary) so that we are not spanking in anger.
-a limit of 3 or 5 swats
-thorough discussion of the behaviors that provoked the spanking

But once again, we don't have kids yet, so this is all theory at the moment

No I think its great that you guys have thought this through.....DH and I just happen to agree on how we discipline our kids. I know couples who don't agree on one type of punishment and you can just imagine what those kids act like when they don't get their way. We follow pretty much the same guidelines you guys have already put into place. Both of DH and my parents followed this plan and now we are doing the same thing. Its worked for us so far. Keep in mind that you only have to do this for so long and then the kids just mind. But again I think whatever you do should have consistency!!! Good Luck with your future DD or DS!

Yep in theory we spank...however, of our four kids only two have been spanked and only once each...the other two are smart enough to learn from their siblings! Never in anger, always removed from the situation, taken to another room, explain why they are being disciplined calmly, do the deed and pray with them, give them a hug and kiss and tell them that no matter what we love them...just not their behavior at the time.

I've washed one mouth out with soap too for biting when old enough to know better...that has never happened again either!

I have also heard of using hot sauce on the tongue as a punishment for biting, backtalking, saying forbidden words, etc. Not sure how I feel about it, but I know parents who've done that.

Mine are 10 and almost 13, so not anymore. We did when they were younger, but it was a very few times. We typically used time outs or loss of priviliges. Spanking was a very last resort.

Lisa

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"It's not having what you want,
It's wanting what you've got"

I mostly just give timeouts and take toys away, My 2 yr old for instance likes to hit his sisters and I feel like how can I teach him not to hit if I'm hitting him. You are basically telling him its ok for me to hit but not for you. My children seem to get more upset if they have to sit and watch others play than for me to hit them and allow them to continue playing.

My son is too young to spank, but I don't think we will. Maybe a light swat on the butt . . . My DH was treated pretty roughly by his Dad, and harbors some resentment towards him for it. I don't think he will EVER spank his own son

every now and then.. I find that taking something away that they have earned works much better for my kids.

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Too many people spend money they haven't earned to buy things they don't want, to impress people they don't like. - Will Rogers

We use time-out as much as possible. I also ground my kids from things (friends, TV, the house). However sometimes the only thing that gets the message across is a good swat on the bum. After their punishment, whatever it may be, we sit and talk about why they were in trouble and what they can do next time instead. We are trying to teach our kids the "do unto others" attitude. It is slowly working.

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TLJ ~ Where opinions are encouraged, not deleted

You laugh at me because I am different,
I laugh at you because you are all the same.

Your mind is like a parachute, it only works when it is open.

Colegirl, I just wanted you to know that most people do not refer to spanking as hitting. Spanking are on the backside with no physical and emotional harm. Hitting to me implys out-of-control behavior(the crazy walmart mom) that is trying to really hurt someone and do damage physically and emotionally. Just wanted to be clear on that.

We all just had this discussion on the board so recently- and the same point came up. But, however, you slice it, spanking IS hitting. It might make some people feel better to avoid that word, but if you are a spanker, and were asked to honestly answer whether you HIT your child, you'd have to say yes.

I know some parents choose to spank, but we never did. For us, time outs, talking about the problem, and using consequences (loss of privileges or toys) worked best. Our children are extremely well-behaved. I know my children are grateful that they have never been hit. My oldest said she was lucky, because we "respected" her by not spanking her when she was young. I'm proud of that.

We definitely have two different opinions of what hitting is.....thats just how its going to be...but just wanted to know what others choose to doin your own home.

All spanking isn't hitting, just like all sex isn't rape.

We dont spank. We use time outs, and take away computer time, or something else.

Ages are 9, 7, and 4.

Jason

I'd have to agree that "spanking" is not the same as "hitting" ...

When kids hit each other, it is typically not once and typically not a swat on the butt.

And, honestly, I've swatted my kids on the butt while playing with them (and they were laughing the whole time) harder than I've spanked them. Spanking (at least in our house) was more tone of voice accompanied by a swat than it was hardness of the swat.

JMTC,

Lisa

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"It's not having what you want,
It's wanting what you've got"

So you spank for physical and emotional pleasure? I'm confused.

You theorize that you use spanking as a form of correcting a wrong behavior, so if you are not intending to cause physical pain- what are your intentions when spanking? Shame at having their backside exposed? To demonstrate control? ( I can hold you down against your will?)

With all due respect, your child, your choice. But to sugar coat it and say it is not hitting is a bit far fetched. Of course you are causing physical pain- isn't that the point? If spankings didn't hurt, you wouldn't administer them.

I can't even IMAGINE having a paddle specifically designed for spankings. It's obvious that we are a diverse board of backgrounds and upbringings. Again, your child your choice. If you believe in spanking, I am not going to tell you are wrong or bad. You are just different than me.

Never spanked ....and never will. We feel all punishment can be accomplished without violence.

Wow- your choice to make an analogy of spanking/hitting with sex/rape. Even I think that's a little extreme...

All sex isn't rape because rape occurs when one person doesn't consent.
Are you implying that your child consents to spankings?


But all spanking IS hitting. I think you what you meant to convey was that all hitting isn't spanking. The word "hitting" encompasses spanking AND endless other types of strikes.

I am not passing judgement on parenting styles. Like someone else put it, "your child, your choice." - but I DO believe you should know that if you've just SPANKED your child, you have just HIT your child.

I did ask the last time this topic came around for examples from spankers of an example of a time that spanking is the best choice. No examples were given, and I'm still wondering. Is there truly such a time?

When my kids were toddlers we did spank, simply because at that age, they cannot understand comprehend a discussion about what they did wrong. We would swat their butt (with a diaper on) and swat their hands (which some consider spanking as well but we don't). We used time outs first along with words (NO, describing exactly what they did wrong, etc) and then a spanking (if needed). As they grew older, we could more easily take away things like computer and tv time. They are 5 & 7 now and the youngest probably got 2 spankings her whole life and the oldest got his last one at 5. I personally don't think spanking is as effective once they are old enough to talk and discuss the problem but that is in our experience. I mean, you aren't going to spank your 13 year old (at least I wouldn't think so...)
I don't think my discipline is better than anyone else's

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Proud to say I haven't shopped at a Wal-Mart since Sept 2003

I have to say that I believe that the implication is that someone is bad if they "hit" their child. When one refuses to acknowledge a distinction between the intent of the parent and the perception of the child, there can be no understanding.

I was spanked. I was never hit. I had physical pain on my rear end that I wanted to avoid having again. It was not something my parents did to me as revenge, nor was I simply an outlet for their anger and lack of self-control, manifest in a crazy rage just to make them feel better.

I hid my brother's favorite toy, lied about it, watched him cry for a couple of hours while he thought it was gone forever, and eventually got caught in my bratty ways. After a calm talking-to, I had to bend over and out came the flyswatter.

I was a smooth talker of a kid and a real pretender. I actually liked being sent to my room, because I could lay there on my bed by myself and think up stories I'd write and places I'd go and things I'd do. That wasn't punishment to me.

But I absolutely had an aversion to pain - even the ten second harmless pain that follows a swat on the rear end. If I thought I'd get spanked for a behavior, you can bet your boots I wouldn't do it.

I know children who were hit. They had bruises and a sorrow-filled life. They had a deep sadness in their eyes and a cagey fear of other people. Even after their dad went off to jail, they still carried those emotional scars from being beat for no reason at all.

As I implied above, if all spanking is hitting, then all sex is rape.

I will do anything else before I spank & when I spank which has probably only been 3 times in the 12yrs I been a mom its obviously not hard because my kids usually just laugh at me my middle dd is the one I would say drove me over the edge to spank before her my oldest has never been spanked, middle dd though she could really push it to the limit shes alot better these days usually sending my kids to bed works best. They get that going to bed to take a nap is not fun but usually solves the problem cause usually their attitudes come from being tired.

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mom of 3 greats girls

No, I said what I meant to say.

You are implying that all spanking IS hitting. It's not an extreme analogy. Not at all.

What draws the line between sex and rape? Rape is the intent of one of the two people involved to unload his own rage and dysfunction on another person in a way that is emotionally and physically harmful to them with absolutely no positive intent. By definition, has sex taken place in a rape? Yes. But a rape victim would never, ever say, "I had sex with him." Rape is about power for power's sake.

Each of those things is true of abusive hitting, as well.

I realize you say you are not passing judgement on parenting styles, but I have to disagree. The refusal to acknowledge that intent on the part of the parent determines the perception the child has about what has transpired in a spanking is VASTLY different than a child who has been beaten is, by definition, asserting that the two events - a spanking and a beating - are equal.

By definition, is a child hit/struck on the rear end when he/she is spanked. You betcha. But we all know that in our vernacular, if you hear that someone *HIT* someone, the implication is that it was a blow struck in anger, like two guys in a bar using each other as punching bags.

Webster's Dictionary:

Spank: to strike especially on the buttocks with an open hand
Hit: to strike with force, to make forcefully contact with something

To me that indicates a huge difference...used properly, in control of your emotions it can be a very effective tool of discipline. Spankings occur only on the "south end", a quick swat. Hitting could be the face, back, leg or anywhere else and tends to occur out of anger.

In ten years we have spanked twice...both for actions that were life endangering to the child or another person. Time-outs are fine for toddlers/preschoolers who take someone's toy away. Taking a computer or TV away is great for a school age child who is disrespectful. We believe that the punishment needs to fit the crime!

I am appalled at the behavior that most parents let their kids get away with these days and ironically so are our children. They'll even comment about how badly a child is behaving. They learned at a very young age what was acceptable and what wasn't. They never misbehave in public because they know we'll go home and usually behave well at home. We haven't used a time out or "grounding" in over a year. They know what is expected of them and they know they'll be punished accordingly.

Nope, never have, never will (DH agrees). Our girls are now 19, 15 & 14 and they are very well behaved, well adjusted kids. I don't believe in spanking but I don't condemn the ones that do. I've seen some kids in stores that need a swat on the butt. LOL!

My daddy has been always been of the opinion that the butt was directly connected to the ears--and sometimes you had to get the butt's attention before you could get the ears' attention.

Meaning sometimes a swat of the butt will cause the child to stop whatever they are doing and listen to what you are saying.

We have spanked/swatted our children's butts. Swatted their hands on occasion. Now as they are getting older, it is easier to reason with them and to take away privileges and ground.

Wanted to add that my Daddy is a minister. His theory on the butt and ears being connected also applies to his sermons. He says that once the butt starts going numb (from sitting on a church pew) then the ears go numb as well and they don't hear what you are saying. That's why his sermons on Sunday morning are not long at all--usually 20-30 min.!

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

My son is to old now but I spanked when he was young.

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Laura
Please visit my blog
http://mylifeinlaurasworld.blogspot.com/

3 kids here :13,10 and 5 and we do not spank!!!
no need to ,we talk to them and take away privileges.you know ,a 13 year old gilr who can't talk on the phone for 1 month ,is very eager to clean her room,empty the dishwasher and not bicker with her sibblings.....
we stick with our punishements...

but why spank?what is the reason why you have to lay a hand on a child?what did that child do,that the only thing you can come up with is a spanking?

The above seems to be very judgmental and condescending...

And it depends on your definition of spanking. Does a swat on the behind or swatting the hands constitute spanking to you? If so, I have swatted their hands as they were reaching to grab something hot (I'd much rather them have a little red mark on their hand than a blister/burn). I have swatted their behinds to get their attention. As in they started to run across the street and I grabbed them and swatted their behinds and then explained just how serious running into the street could be...

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Quite frankly, I think this is a subject that is better off to leave undiscussed as it always tends to degenerate. It's like politics - each has their own side and there's no convincing one side to come over to the other.

That said, I don't spank my older son..he's 17, 6 feet tall and 200 lbs. I'm 5'3"

but it doesn't have to degenerate into arguments. If people can state their opinion without being rude and condescending. I have no problem with someone saying "this works for us--it might not work for you" and some people have said that. I don't have issue with others saying "I think spanking and hitting are the same in my book thus I choose not to spank."

I agree that no one is going to change another's mind

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

OPEN LETTER TO COUPON COURTNEY:

I would like to say that this information has been digested and let go because clearly you where just trying to be nasty to say that I would ever spank my child for emotional pleasure. I don't think that anyone but you took my statement earlier to mean that. I would also like to say that I don't make my children pull their pants down to show their backsides NOR have I EVER held them down......I don't know where you got your information about me personally but, you must just be misinformed.

I have a 5 year old who is very active.she is with me in the kicthen while I cook.she climbs on a stool to look at what I am doing.the stove is on,but i always have my eyes on her.if she tries to reach for the hot pan,I simply tell her no before she gets teh chance to touch anything.no need to swat her for that.she is no longer trying to reach for anything.she just ask me : is it hot?
and the same for dough I make,she will ask first : eggs in it?she knows that she can not eat raw eggs.
as far as running across the street: i hold her hand,she is never out of my sight(i am overprotective maybe...for sure...).and we tell her everytime and show her : look to your left ,look to your right,look to your left and walk...she automatically gives me her hand.
and believe me when I say she is active,she is like the commercial with the bunny....never stops....

I was never spanked as a child,on the other hand my dh was spanked,hit ,abused,neglected....you name it, he was defenseless...he has scars on his body....more than once he was black and blue.and nobody did a thing about it...( that's an another story!!!!)
not to say that everybody who spanks is abusing their kids.but that is why we have a very strong opinion on that subject..I just wanted to know what makes it ok to spank...

And I always have my eyes on my children--but sometimes they are quicker than I am. It happens. Given the choice I would much rather tell them "no, that's hot". I always hold my children's hands while crossing the street, but there have been occasions when they jerked away to run after something (a lost balloon, their daddy who was walking ahead, etc.). Things happen. Of course, the swats I referred to were when they were 2-3 y/o. I also have very stubborn children who would touch something just to see if it really was hot! I have a child who has actually held his breath until he passed out (at age 4).

Your post seems to imply, and maybe I'm wrong, that if you spank you're doing it because you aren't vigilant enough with your children.

Of course your DH's experience as an ABUSED child has helped form your opinion of any sort of physical punishment. Just like children who were raised in by alcoholics will not drink as adults because they know the EXTREMES of drinking. (DH is one of those). But to imply that someone doesn't watch their children or are abusing their children by spanking is rude and condescending. It's all in how you present an argument.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

When my oldest son was younger, I didn't believe in spanking. He was a very strong willed child and when he was 3, I had to seriously reconsider my views. Now we do spank our children--very rarely. Never when angry, and we take them into a separate room so the other children aren't watching. We use other forms of discipline for the part, but sometimes a good swat on the butt is just what they need to correct a certain behavior. We always make sure they understand we are disciplining them out of love and they usually get it.

Proverbs 13:24 - He who spares the rod hates his son, but he who loves him is careful to discipline him.

Proverbs 22:15 - Folly is bound up in the heart of a child, but the rod of discipline will drive it far from him.

Proverbs 23:13 Do not withhold discipline from a child; if you punish him with the rod, he will not die.

I have to admit when my daughter was younger she did get spankings.BUT if i had to do over i would have resorted to other ways of punishment.She is 20 now and a very well rounded young woman.I did as she got older take things away from her for punishment.I felt that worked better for us and with alot less stress,She actually did better with that sort of punishment.I think she would have rather gotten a spanking anyday that take away her tv time.Everyone learns by their mistakes and wished we would have done things differently in some ways but don't beat yourself or others up for their ways of dicipline. I'm sure all ways have their good and bad results. I wish i could have had a Nanny 911 call many times but not all of us are fortunate enough to have had that show when our children grew up.:-)

Here is my opinion. I think that it is all in the way you were raised. If you were spanked as a child then you might be more likely to spank your child. If you were not spanked as a child you most likely do not spank your child.

We are all parents here and I don't think one of us is out to abuse our children. We are all doing the best we can with the tools God has given us. To argue over the way someone else raises their children is such a waste of time. I think that this post was put up to compare each of our parenting styles. We have never walked in the other persons shoes and have no idea as to what the other person is thinking.

You guys also have to remember... you are reading this and not seeing or hearing the other person speak. There is a lot to be said about talking to someone in person. I have found that when I email letters to people I sound very mean and I really don't mean to. If you tried to read each post with a positive attitude that may help.

Bottom line...You ALL love your children and are ALL very good parents with different parenting styles. Live and let live.

Be kind to each other.

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cmemaloy@yahoo.com


I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not.

Life! is a coin. You can spend it anyway you wish, but you can only spend it once.

Spanking aka hitting is something if done to an adult would consititute an illegal act. Therefore if you can be arrested for hitting or even "spanking" your neighbor perhaps you shouldn't be doing it to someone who looks up to you and learns from you. I don't buy this semantics spanking IS hitting no matter how hard your hand hits a childs butt.

That said- I remember hearing somewhere else and have to agree- Spanking between consenting adults is fine with me so long as I am not invited

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All you can do is All you can do-- But All you can do is enough!!!

I think what I infer a lot in these discussions - and it may be that I am way off and that people aren't intending to imply what I take away - is that those who spank are not as good parents because they don't have the capability to actually have to think through the issue, have a discussion, and end up with children with a deeper understanding of the problems. I perceive it being said that spanking is the cop out way to deal with things, that it's unenlightened and almost barbaric, and that spanking and physical abuse are on the same plain... and that those who take the time to come up with other methods are smarter, love their children more, and... you get the picture.

Often, it seems people mention groundings as an alternative punishment. What is a grounding? It's a denial of privlidges for a specific time, intended to bring about emotional pain that the child will hopefully want to avoid in the future.

Taken to the extreme, a parent who is emotionally abusive to a child and never lets them have any fun, any privlidges, and confines them to the house all the time has essentially developed a mindset that mimics "permanent grounding."

And yet, nobody who grounds is ever accused of being emotionally abusive, because it is obvious that their intent is different, and the children involved in each situation are, in their hearts, fully aware if their grounding is a punishment doled out for a specific wrong behavior the child committed or if it's just that they have psycho parents who won't allow them to have a life.

When our kids were younger and got spanked occasionally, it wasn't done as a last resort. Sometimes, it was the first resort. That's probably because I didn't see it as the most extreme possible punishment there is. To me, groundings for a week are more extreme. I understand why for some families groundings aren't a big deal, but for us, to ground a child meant re-arranging playdates and schedules and it meant the whole family, for a week, had to work around the fact that one child wasn't to be having any fun and confined to the house. As a child, I remember my mom grounding me sometimes, and I was such a smooth talker that I spent my whole week trying to devise ways to get out of it. I didn't even so much mind the solitude as it was that I considered it a challenge to try to figure out some way to un-do the grounding, and I had a whole week to plot and plan. I was just that sneaky. lol I was a little stinker, and I remember one time pretending to cry so she'd feel badly. I don't remember if it worked, but I do remember it causing her some turmoil and ... it just drug the issue out for an entire week for the whole family.

A spanking is quick, and then it's over. The sting is a physical one, and it lasts under a minute. There shouldn't be a bruise, and there shouldn't be a scar. And one it's over... it's over. Was it easier to me to spank than to ground? Oh, yes. Was it less frustrating for all of us? Oh, yes. It was quick, and it was over, and then we moved on with our lives.

And our kids hated the thought of a swat so much that they would do what they could do avoid another one. It seems crazy, because it *was* such a short term "OUCH!", but they really did not want spanked.

The other thing I remember is the crying after a spanking. They nearly always cried, and oddly enough, I think that was cathartic for them. It's like whatever the issue was that led up to them being in trouble found it's release in a good cry, kind of like we adults experience after a good cry. I am sure my kids didn't cry because the pain was so intense, since we didn't ever spank that hard. It's just that the idea of the swat, and then the swat, made it all come to a head for them and once their tears were dried up five minutes later, everybody was ready to start over fresh.

I haven't spanked anyone for ages and ages. Most spankings that happened at our house before they entered school, and they behave very well now. I do think children can be raised to be happy, healthy adults with or without spanking, and don't think all discipline must be carried out with a swat. I just don't think it's the lesser, most extreme of all punishments to be avoided until all other options have been exhausted.