I know there are several teachers on these boards, so maybe they can provide another sidde to this that I just don't see. My daughter is in 6th grade, here that is middle school, and is a straight A student. She works really hard to keep all of her classes at 100% and takes a lot of pride in her GPA and the work she does for her classes. She has always worked well in groups and though I have a problem with the whole idea of working in groups for a grade, it has not ever been an issue, until now. Yesterday she got in the car after school steaming mad and near tears. Friday they were paired into groups for a Geography project, by last name, of the two kids she was paired with one is a girl who we h ave had peer issues with for the last 4 years, and the teacher told her to just see how it went, luckily it went ok with the girl. The boy they were paired with though, oh man! they had to make a 3-D map of land forms which was fine, they finshed it and put it ont he counter to dry, thereby turning it in. They also had to do a 2-D map and a paper with the definition of all the land forms they used on the map. They ran out of time, as did most of the class, my daughter brought home the definitions, and the boy was supposed to do the 2-D map over the weekend and turn it in on Monday. As my daughter was leaving class on Friday the boy in her group walked over to the counter and mashed all their land forms flat, this class is at the end of the day so she asked if she could bring it home and fix it, the answer was no, or it would be counted late. She asked to stay and fix it, the answer was no, the teacher had somewhere to be, the map that was now ruined was the map that would be used for the grade. They boy did indeed do the 2-D map over the weekend, but he did not do it in color as was directed so they lost some points on that, as the other members of the group were not allowed to fix it before turning it in. The boy also was absent on Monday, then we had Tuesday off and he returned to school Wed. and turned in the paper. It was counted as late, and they were docked again. The bottom line is the project got a D grade! My daughter is distraught and I am furious with the teacher. We have an email and voice mail out to ask for a conference. While I understand that kids need to learn to work well with others, how is it right to assign their partners and then punish them all because of the shoddy work of one of them? This is hurting my daughter's grade, she did everything she could do to make the project right, and I have non idea how to even convey my feelings about this to this teacher who is normally one of my daughter's favorite teachers without seeming or feeling like a pushy, overbearing Mom. Any insight into this....anyone?

I'm with you on the group project thing. Somebody always ends up being a slacker, and someone always ends up carrying way too much of the project because they care about their grades.

As for this situation--there is no way my child would be getting a D on a grade because some kid smashed the project. Particularly since it happened IN school!! Hopefully you'll make some headway with the conference. If not, I'd be at the principal and moving on up the line until somebody with some common sense acknowledged that a child who is this destructive a) has behavioral issues and b) should not be in charge of other kids' grades.

Good luck. Please let us know how it happens.

I hate group projects. I hated them as a kid and I do not look forward for the day my children get them. I know *I* always ended up doing 99.9% of the "group project" because I always got paired with the kids who never did their work and my grades were important to me. We had a similar type of issue happen in Junior High and my told me to just do my portion as did my teacher (to whom I had complained about the project to). So I did and of coarse, no one else did a thing. So, we ended up with a "D". My mom marched in there, had a conference with the teacher and the principal and I got my "D" turned into an "A" because the potion I did would have been an A if done on it's own. We weren't told if the others got a D or an F...but I can say that teacher NEVER did a group project that was graded again. Learning to work in a group is one thing.In life we have to work with those we do not like, etc but a child should not have to be graded on someone else's lack of caring/doing the work. Yes, I know in *real life* we often have to do more work to make up for lazy people but it's cruel (to me) to do that to a child

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Both my DS and DD dreaded group projects. That was a hot topic in our house all the time during school. Both my kids ended up doing almost all the project because everyone promised to do work and didn't and with the threat of a bad grade, my kids would spend enormous time working to get it done. They tried to encourage, work together, set goals, blah blah blah, all about groups learning to work together. What they really learned is that you can't count on anyone else and you have to do the work yourself.
Now my DS is in business, and surprise, the same thing exists. He is now carrying the workload of his boss (fortunately all his higher ups see this....BUT he is waiting for the promotion and raise to see if they really recognize it).

I would seriously never back down, but keep insisting on conferences until this matter is resolved. It is so unfair for your child.

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My dd had a group project a few weeks ago and she ended up doing 80% of the work. When the project was turned in, each student had to also include a paper stating what they individually did to contribute to the project, what they each were responsible for, their own opinion on the group project as a whole and to critique the other members of the group. This was a fair way to do it, I feel.

We hate them here, too. My daughter is also a very good, dedicated and conscientious student. Her problem here, is that she is also well behaved. She is now in 9th grade and every since elementary school she has always had to sit by or do projects with the not-well-behaved or problem students because the teachers think she can "help" them. It's not her freaking responsibility to hold their hands and babysit less dedicated students! A problem boy in 5th grade cut her hair because he had scissors and felt like it. We just had a conference with her Spanish teacher. She's always had A's in spanish. But now the teacher counts a lot on participation - not just with the teacher, but with peers. She assigns their seats. My dd is of course next to a low scoring student that the teacher thinks she could help. Well they are in 9th grade, they don't know each other and every time my dd trys to converse with him in Spanish he says "I don't know" in English! Guess what her grade has fallen because of particiption!

I know they need to learn to get along with problem kids and work well in groups, but when it affects their grade - there is nothing they can do about it! My dd has already brought home a couple thing she had to finish up for the group this year. One she brought home over the weekend - the other girl simply said "I don't have time to do this over the weekend - you have to do it." Of course, my dd did. Another one, she was up way past 11PM and exhausted, but it had to be done the next day.

Wow, long winded, but I HATE group projects, too!

Lisa

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There aren't many professional positions that allow a person to work completely independently. As much as you don't like them, group projects are an important life skill builder, in my opinion.

cj/

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That's great, but these are kids and rarely if ever in "real life" in your job does your salary get reduced if someone else doesn;t do their job.

for my son when he was in 5th and 6th grade. They actually had to submit a guideline before so teacher could see who was doing what and if it was equal. This seemed to work great. I don't think their group projects actually counted to much toward their grades point wise.

I'm with you on this one.
As much as I hate group projects they are a part of life.
I am working on my four year degree now and the program is heavy on group projects.
So as much as I hate to say it, get used to it.

That's not true for anyone who manages people, but my real life might be different than yours.

Another life lesson - things aren't always fair and the sooner one realizes it, the better.

These are both lessons that people can and should begin to learn at a young age, in my opinon.

cj/

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I was walking home one night and a guy hammering on a roof called me a paranoid little weirdo. In morse code. -Emo Phillips

I get that in big people life you have to work in groups in your job setting. I would think by the time we are adults, we have a greater voice and more respect from our superiors so we can articulate that Suzy Duzy is not an efficient worker, and we are certainly not going to accept a reduction in salary as a result of her slacking. We also have the ability to tell Suzy she needs to step it up without fear of being slammed into a locker on the way to next period.

The teachers who follow these group projects and grade based on actual fulfillment of responsibilities get my vote! Some kids do not do their work, the teachers know it, and to penalize an entire group because of this kid is not a lesson in fairness. It's a lesson in futility.

Here is one teacher's opinion. I don't like them either for all the reasons listed above. Education has moved in a direction that more and more things are done in groups. In fact, I have been told by principals that I had to do more. Except for tests, that is the way it is going now.

There are more things you learn from working in groups than just the task at hand.

Life is pretty much managing groups of people you manage friends, clubs, events, kids, etc and even if you're not management at work you still have to learn to work with groups and with some who don't do their share (those slackers are still around even at my age).

Now ask me this question in a few years and maybe I won't like them either but I can see the point.

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I understand the point, but the reality is that for kids in that station in life, a tremendous amount is apt to ride on their class rank, GPA, etc. It seems a shame for a student to end up penalized in those areas because someone they didn't even want to work with didn't do his/her work, especially given that they are being rated against other students who may not have gotten stuck working with a group at all.

Grades should not be given for group projects. That way the kids that work hard aren't punished by the slackers. These are kids-they don't need to be saddled with "you need to learn this for when you are in a job situation" in grade school. They don't yet have the adult tools to deal with these situations and plunking them into situations without options isn't really fair. It just teaches the slackers to keep slacking and the good kids to take on the burdens of the slackers. Not a good lesson in my book .

For what it's worth, the OP was talking about a child in the 6th grade.

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I was walking home one night and a guy hammering on a roof called me a paranoid little weirdo. In morse code. -Emo Phillips

IMO, it’s possible the child who intentionally destroyed the project may need help. He could have a self-esteem problem
or even worse (and the one that concerns me), problems at home. Ask your daughter if he exhibits this type behavior
often and when you speak with the teacher, ask her opinion.

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I agree with that poster 100% but to the boy in class that smashed the project, it should of been allowed to be fixed, the boy should of been punished, and since the project could not be fixed, and was the proper way when it came to school, no points should of been deducted.

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People always liked me in their group because I ended up doing alot if not most of the work. I could not stand to get a lower grade simply because everyone else was slacking. In Italian class especially I am fluent and had been there so I always had the best projects. It did not bother me but now I can see how it was not beneficial to me or to them.

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Wow, we never had group projects EVER the whole time I was in school.
I think if there would have been it would have been the girls sucking up to the guys in the group to get the project completed.
Guys love to make girls suck up to get things done.
Thats about the only thing we would have learned,lol.

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At our new school the teacher has projects and you can choose to do it with a group or yourself. The teacher then sends home a paper where the parent must sign approval of the partner that their child is working with. ALSO, projects are being limited and pretty much done away with since the school admins have had this addressed in meetings. Students are busy, do not live near each other and have different schedules. When a child has an extra hour to work on a project they have an extra hour BUT you just cannot put that extra hour on a calendar in advance to get together with your partners.
On this past project my daughter did 95% of the work and group got the grade.
Last year at our old school she knew exactly who to be partners with and who NOT to be in a group with. It really frustrates her but I think it goes back to getting a poor grade and working hard in 5th grade.
I also never liked working in groups in school.

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