I read your question on the other thread and I found this:

Does the Bible support the Catholic practice of a marriage annulment?

"When issued, an annulment does not end the effects conferred by the sacrament. The annulment declares that the sacrament in question was not valid from the start, and the recipient is treated as though he or she never actually received the sacrament. That does not mean that children from the marriage are now considered born out of wedlock or that the ex-spouses committed any sort of fornication. It means that the receipt of the sacrament was somehow flawed. An annulment works like a military court."

I don't think it's a Catholic website so it may not be the exact answer but I think it touches on the truth. My personal belief in the situation that you've described -- was sex during an eventually anulled marriage actually fornication since the marriage is declared null? -- is that God is merciful and if one or both persons in the marriage were sincere in their commitment to the marriage, then it was not fornication.

__________________
Cecilia

"We must love them both--those whose opinions we share and those whose opinions we reject. For both have labored in the search for truth, and both have helped us in the finding of it."
Saint Thomas Aquinas

Post in now locked thread from Marilynk:

<<<<I ask this in all sincerity, and not meant in any snarky or bitchy way:
Do you see any areas of gray? Do you see everything as black or white?

If so, then that explains a lot.
That's probably why your posts tend to stir others to anger. A lot of people see things in varying degrees. If you think and see things in solely black or white then of course it's going to be hard to get others to see your perspective.

I don't agree with you. I do however think I have a better understanding of how your mind works---which helps me understand that you aren't intentionally being obstinate or snarky. >>>>>>>>>


Marilynk, I know you weren't directing this question at me, but I thought I'd throw out an answer, regardless. It's a good question, and I appreciate the respect you have here in looking for understanding of a faith different from yours.

With Catholicism, there are some topics, such as adultery and abortion, where we have no gray areas. It really *is* definitive to us, or black and white.

I also saw on the other thread another poster said in their "opinion" they were not sinning in a particular instance.

If we're Catholic, we don't interpret what is and isn't a sin based on "opinion." It is based on our knowledge and the beliefs of our faith. That is different than using our opinions to decide whether one activity or another is a sin.

There are a lot of times when being a Catholic is difficult. I don't always like the rules, but I do my best to follow them. Other Catholics don't, and that's their choice. (BTW, I also don't consider myself perfect - just someone who is doing her best to interpret and live by her faith). If a Catholic opts for a gray area (an 'opinion' that differs from what our faith tells us) in the areas of adultery, abortion, and other topics that Catholics consider sinful, then they are not, in that instance, practicing their faith.

That doesn't mean I judge them as "bad" and it doesn't make me "better" or "holier than thou." It just makes me/us people who are doing their best to practice their faith, regardless of what others do/think/say.

__________________
"The errors of faith are better than the best thoughts of unbelief." - Thomas Russell

Thanks! I appreciate it.

While I don't fully understand how a person doesn't see areas of gray, it does make it easier for me to comprehend when certain posters post the things they do.

It was really kind of a "lightbulb" moment when I realized that some people don't see in shades of gray.

__________________
Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Ok, I've been thinking about this. I don't think there's a clear cut yes or no on this question. Just as there are many reasons for an annulment I think each case would have to be looked at. For example, let's say Dirk and I get married. I marry in good fatih, etc... However Dirk was married in England and never got divorced before he came to the States and hid that fact from me, the Church, the law, etc... Obviously Dirk was fully aware that he was not being honest in his marriage vows whereas I was. So im my opinion, and that's just what is it, I would say that yes, he was fornicating but I wasn't. Does that make sense? I think just as there are many reasons for annulments and each annulment has to be looked at individually I think that would also apply to your question. There are not necessarily quick answers as to whether or not a marriage can be annuled, it has to go to a tribunal, etc...so it would follow that your question would have to be answered in accordance with the specifics of the actual annulment.

I'm not Catholic, but regarding the 'shades of gray' issue....

I believe that there are certain actions and/or behaviors that are unquestionably wrong in the eyes of God.

Where we tend to want to see something is *gray* - which means it isn't as *bad* as the really bad things - are when our *feelings* get involved.

Not trying to get into the gay debate whatsoever here, just using it as an example....

I believe that God *is*, and when I read the Bible - the only document I recognize as God-inspired direction for mankind - the only conclusion I can draw about homosexual sex is that it is against the wishes of God.

I know several gay people, and I understand it's not some switch you can flick on and off, and it makes me sad for them that if they are to follow God's intentions as I believe them to be, those friends will live life solo. I don't understand why God would indicate he doesn't like something, but also allow people to be born or to be influenced in such a way that those attractions exist.

My sadness about the matter is what it is.... sadness for them. It doesn't change the fact that I don't see any straightfoward, substantial evidence that God finds homosexual behavior to be holy in the same way that he considers the 'one flesh' concept that is presented when a man and woman unite.

So to me, the issue regarding whether that behavior is permissible in God's eyes is black and white. And I think it is easy for people - when they have an emotional tie to a gay person - who would, were they to encounter .... well, how do I say this? Say another topic that was not so emotionally-charged were presented in the Bible in ways identical to those homosexuality is discussed. If there were no *feelings* involved, those people might have an easy time saying, "It's bad! It's wrong! Don't do it!" But because they might care about the gay person and want them not to be alone, they might find a way to reason away why that issue is gray.

I don't think in terms of gray much at all. I think if something is not wrong, then it's white. For me, the Bible is my compass, and if it's not condemned there, it's all white. Sometimes there are issues of *judgement*, because too much of a 'white' thing can turn black. Like... alcohol. Jesus made wine at a wedding so he can't be entirely against it! However, we are warned not to be a drunkard and given over to the influences of wine. For that reason, I see wine itself as *white*. It's not forbidden so there is no reason to enmesh any grey with it.

But it's a judgment call to determine when one has become a drunkard.... and I don't really consider that 'gray'.