Posts are open and unmoderated, and do not necessarily reflect the views of MyCoupons. | Obscene, abusive, silly, or annoying remarks may be deleted, but the fact that particular comments remain on the site in no way constitutes an endorsement of their views by MyCoupons. | Posts that contain phone numbers, addresses, or other personal information will also be deleted. | REMEMBER: posting at MyCoupons is a privilege, not a right. Abuse that privilege, and your account may be banned. | | | | | You are not currently logged in. | | | | | | * ELECTION 2008 * America's Choice - 'E08' This board is for discussion of the candidates and issues in our political process. Our National Election is on November 4, 2008 to select a new President, Vice President, and many state and local officials. Left, Right, or Center ~ You are All Welcome Here! So let’s hear your comments and opinions… | 
06-07-2008, 04:00 PM
| | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,161
Rep Power: 25 | | I thought that it was a very gracious concession. I cannot put a link in directly to the video, but the whole thing is on Josh Marshall's site. Talking Points Memo | 
06-07-2008, 06:09 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | | I agree, it was a gracious speech. I wish she'd made it Tuesday night, but I'm glad that she made it now. | 
06-07-2008, 07:28 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Northern Californi
Posts: 1,817
Rep Power: 43 | | | I think that HRC made the speech she needed and wanted to make at the correct time for herself and I do not believe for a second that waiting 2 or 3 days did ANY damage to the Democratic party or process. Mrs. Clinton earned the right to be able to choose to take her time and honor the wishes of those who have supported her through this campaign. To deny her that right would not have been right and I think to try and take away the impact and importance and graciousness of her words is a little bit ungracious in my opinion.
__________________ "Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous
"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity
| 
06-07-2008, 07:53 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | | Clinton's refusal to give Obama his well-earned victory on Tuesday night was extremely ungracious, IMO. Allowing Terry McAuliffe to introduce her that night as the next president of the US, when she knew full well that he had won the nomination -- and she'd had weeks to recognize the inevitability of that result -- was rude.
Her graciousness today will always be tainted by her selfishness Tuesday night. | 
06-07-2008, 09:03 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Northern Californi
Posts: 1,817
Rep Power: 43 | | | That is one person's personal opinion...certainly not mine. AND...she is not Terry McAuliffe and not Terry's speechwriter. Hillary has earned the right to hold her head high and retain the respect she has earned.
Although I strongly disagree with you on this, we both want what is best for this country.....and I am sure the White House is in for some major Democratic healing of this country.
__________________ "Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous
"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity
| 
06-08-2008, 05:00 AM
| | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,161
Rep Power: 25 | | | I certainly don't think that Clinton hurt anything by waiting until Saturday. The primary battle was long, hard fought, and very close. Many of her supporters wanted her to take it to the convention.
I think the short delay gave her supporters time to deflate and come to terms with the loss. | 
06-08-2008, 06:31 AM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by kvmj I think the short delay gave her supporters time to deflate and come to terms with the loss. | I think the delay gave her supporters false hope that she would take it to the convention and now many of them are madder than ever. | 
06-08-2008, 10:05 AM
| | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,161
Rep Power: 25 | | | I don't think that really happened. Surely by Wednesday afternoon her supporters had come to terms with the loss.
I think she had a few supporters who were in her camp just because they wanted to see a woman become president. | 
06-08-2008, 10:08 AM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by kvmj I don't think that really happened. Surely by Wednesday afternoon her supporters had come to terms with the loss.
I think she had a few supporters who were in her camp just because they wanted to see a woman become president. |
I'm at another board where many of her supporters are utterly enraged at her having had the nomination "stolen" from her. They're writing to demand she take it to the convention. If she doesn't succeed in getting the nomination, they plan on voting for McCain.
There is real rage among some of her supporters and what McAuliffe said only fueled it. HRC took far too long to do the right thing, IMO. | 
06-08-2008, 11:26 AM
| | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,161
Rep Power: 25 | | | If they're going to vote for McCain, how could they support Clinton in the first place? | 
06-08-2008, 11:29 AM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | | I can't figure that one out, either! It doesn't make any sense at all. I can only think they're horribly angry and bitter about her losing the nomination.
Hopefully they'll come around with some perspective by November and see that McBush is not who we need! | 
06-08-2008, 11:58 AM
| | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,161
Rep Power: 25 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by truble2301 Hopefully they'll come around with some perspective by November and see that McBush is not who we need! | I think that I prefer "McSame." | 
06-08-2008, 12:07 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by kvmj I think that I prefer "McSame." | I heard McCainey somewhere the other day, too! | 
06-08-2008, 12:30 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Nov 1999 Location: Land of the Sky
Posts: 2,102
Rep Power: 38 | | | I am a Clinton supporter and so are most of my relatives and friends. We also like Obama and have no problem voting for him. He wasnt our first choice but he also isnt a bad choice. I think Hillary did everything just right. Waiting 4 days for that speech was worth it. She could not have done anywhere as good a job pointing her supporters to Obama if she had had to make a speech Tuesday. And she only took 4 days. Other runners up have taken much longer to give their full support to the winner.
There will be a few supporters who will be too disappointed to vote at all but I think most will come around. This is just my opinion and I know the Hillary haters will never agree. | 
06-08-2008, 12:42 PM
| | Master | | Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,549
Rep Power: 40 | | | As a Senator Obama supporter I think I was mostly disappointed that the historic nature of his win wasn't celebrated as I had hoped. It wasn't the fault of Senator Clinton although IMO her being introduced Tuesday night as "the next President of the US" didn't help matters at all. It also would have been an historic moment if she had won and I can't help but think her supporters would feel as his do if the roles had been reversed. BTW, as an Obama supporter I don't "hate" Senator Clinton and do admire the speech she gave yesterday. | 
06-08-2008, 01:07 PM
|  | Lifetime Member - Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Oct 1999
Posts: 8,580
Rep Power: 86 | | | I'm not a Hillary hater either. In fact, many of us were in both camps several months ago, and before that were incredibly proud of all the candidates running.
These last months were brutal, and we sort of ....broke...from one another. We were subtly pitted against each another. A lot of it, IMO, was the media's doing in how they treated the candidates and how they classified us voters. And then it trickled to us supporters, who then started arguing with one another. And there were people on the opposite side that poked, prodded and furthered the rift.
Sen. Clinton did a great job in her conceding. It made me remember why I admired her for many years. | 
06-08-2008, 01:18 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by AMulquin We were subtly pitted against each another. | I agree. Where I disagree is who did it. I trace my dislike of HRC to her husband's comments after the SC primary ("Jesse Jackson won South Carolina in '84 and '88. Jackson ran a good campaign. And Obama ran a good campaign here.") and to her own comment: Quote:
“I think that since we now know Sen. (John) McCain will be the nominee for the Republican Party, national security will be front and center in this election. We all know that. And I think it’s imperative that each of us be able to demonstrate we can cross the commander-in-chief threshold,” the New York senator told reporters crowded into an infant’s bedroom-sized hotel conference room in Washington.
“I believe that I’ve done that. Certainly, Sen. McCain has done that and you’ll have to ask Sen. Obama with respect to his candidacy,” she said.
| When you trash your fellow Democrat and prop up the opposition, you lose me.
Rhymes with witch. | 
06-08-2008, 01:42 PM
|  | Lifetime Member - Expert | | Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,375
Rep Power: 42 | | | I thought the speech was really good and I dislike listening to speeches, even hers. She set the right tone and covered what needed to be covered. I felt better afterwards. Maybe not exactly in the Obama conga line but thinking about it.
According to some of the talking heads, she drew strong support from independent voters who would normally lean Republican. That might explain why some are saying that they will vote for Bush Lite.
As for me, personally, I'm glad she waited to give the speech. I did not want to hear it on Tuesday. I knew it was coming, but I was not ready to listen. I'm still not happy about it but I will probably, perhaps come around. At this point you can use reason all you want, but I don't want to hear reason. And I'm sure, were the shoes on the Obama supporters feet, they would feel the same way. As time goes by, that will probably change unless Obama, or his supporters, do something so awful that I can't let it go. Like him putting a Republican on the ticket or even a semi-Republican like Jim Webb would make me pause. | 
06-08-2008, 07:13 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Northern Californi
Posts: 1,817
Rep Power: 43 | | | I don't like it or agree with it when people blame Hillary for what Bill said or what Terry said or what anyone but Hillary said; let people speak for themselves. If you place blame on her for all her supporters said then you have to place blame on Mr. Obama for what his supporters say and said, and, as with Rev. Wright, you know that would not be fair. Place the blame where it lies and you will be making a more fair comparison. I find it odd that many Obama supporters seem to be saying that unless Hillary apologizes for fighting the long hard fight they will continue to call her the word that rhymes with witch. I know that when men fight long hard compaigns they are not considered $itches but warriors. I don't believe that Hillary is a divider in this battle....but supporters on both sides of the coin, both on this board and outside in the "real world", continue to place up walls and blame, rather than trying to unite in producing the correct outcome in the upcoming election. Time for gloating, blame-placing and whining (whining on both sides) to be over and the unity to begin.
__________________ "Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich
"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous
"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity
| 
06-08-2008, 07:50 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000
Posts: 13,776
Rep Power: 71 | | | I see no reason not to hold HRC responsible for her own words. If she disagreed with Bill's race-baiting, she should have said so. I think it's reasonable to hold her responsible for the comments of her husband's that she, by her silence, condones.
As for the comment about fighting the long fight, I said nothing of the kind, so I'm sure that's not directed at me. I call her that word for her comments about Obama, which I made perfectly clear. | 
06-08-2008, 08:42 PM
| | Master | | Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,120
Rep Power: 46 | | Quote:
Originally Posted by truble2301 I see no reason not to hold HRC responsible for her own words. If she disagreed with Bill's race-baiting, she should have said so. I think it's reasonable to hold her responsible for the comments of her husband's that she, by her silence, condones. | I think this comment goes to the heart of why issues such as Wright have the power to be so stinging. There are people who flippantly say things that are so far removed from what I believe to be true, and those aren't people I'd choose to keep in my life - or at least not in my life and consider them to be mentors to me. While you'd be hard pressed to find two people in the world who believe the same about every issue, I can say that there are people with whom I generally *agree* with on most things that I find entirely unimpressive because of their attitudes, and I'd never allow myself to be aligned with them. At most, I'd feel compelled to acknowledge that while we do agree on issues, I did not condone their attitude or tone.
When HRC allowed her husband to go off like he did - more than once, it seems - she then became complicit in his statements when she did not refute them. | 
06-09-2008, 09:56 PM
|  | Ultimate Member | | Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Si, Se Puede!
Posts: 6,194
Rep Power: 81 | | Is there a reason you feel the need to bring Wright (who isn't running for president) up in almost every conversation regarding Obama? 
__________________ "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus | 
06-09-2008, 10:54 PM
| | | |