Mr. Minister, Mr. Christian, Mr. Chuckabee last night claimed that Sarah Palin got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla than Joe Biden did running for president. That would be a lie.

Link

Fred Thompson claimed that McCain refused to deal with his Vietnamese captors on giving up information in exchange for medical treatment. That would be a lie. That's exactly what McCain did.


Link

McCain claimed that Palin was an experienced public official while Obama was a mere community organizer (talk to Martin Luther King's family about how worthless those community officials are). That would be a lie.

Link

Add your lie! I'd say Lie of the Day, but they come far too fast and furious for that.

[quote=truble2301;3040546]Link

Fred Thompson claimed that McCain refused to deal with his Vietnamese captors on giving up information in exchange for medical treatment. That would be a lie. That's exactly what McCain did.




Link



Back off about the details of McCain's military experience. It's a moot point. I'll take a stab in the dark and assume you've never fought for your country. McCain was willing to die for it to perserve the freedoms we have. McCain didn't say these things; he can't control what they are saying.

__________________
" Even though life can be a very long, hard, stressful and never-ending journey, never lose hope in what you want the most."

[quote=momtolfi;3040564]You mean back-off calling his campaign on the lies about his military experience? Noun, verb, POW. That's MCCain's campaign these days. It's fair game, because HE put it out there.


Just curious -- did you tell the Swift Boaters to back off Kerry?

[quote=momtolfi;3040564]It's not a moot point. McCain sang like a bird.

Truble is fighting for her country right now by trying to get avoid another tragic choice in Presidency.

McCain fought with a gun...not words. I really don't think that posting on a computer is fighting for your county...to each their own, I guess. Don't worry, my husband and other military will pick up that gun for her.

__________________
" Even though life can be a very long, hard, stressful and never-ending journey, never lose hope in what you want the most."

[quote=momtolfi;3040564][quote=momtolfi;3040546

Back off about the details of McCain's military experience. It's a moot point. I'll take a stab in the dark and assume you've never fought for your country. McCain was willing to die for it to perserve the freedoms we have. McCain didn't say these things; he can't control what they are saying.[/QUOTE]

Strangly this wasn't an off-limits topic when Kerry was running. Why would this be any different in this race?

__________________
I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

More GOP lies

"GOP Convention Spin September 3, 2008
Lieberman and Thompson make misleading claims about Obama on Day Two of the party in St. Paul.

Summary
Joe Lieberman and his former Senate colleague Fred Thompson both made misleading claims about Obama in their prime time GOP convention speeches on Tuesday. We've heard two of them before – many times.

Lieberman said Obama hadn't "reached across party lines" to accomplish "anything significant," though Obama has teamed with GOP Sens. Tom Coburn and Richard Lugar to pass laws enhancing government transparency and curtailing the proliferation of nuclear and conventional weapons.

Thompson repeated misleading claims about Obama's tax program, saying it would bring "one of the largest tax increases in American history." But as increases go, Obama's package is hardly a history-maker. It would raise taxes for families with incomes above $250,000. Most people would see a cut.

Lieberman also accused Obama of "voting to cut off funding for our American troops on the battlefield." But Obama's only vote against a war-funding bill came after Bush vetoed a version of the bill Obama had supported – and McCain urged the veto."

FactCheck.org: GOP Convention Spin

Do you really think that any of us should take up arms and march on Washington because we loathe what Republicans have done to this country?

It's much better to spread information and views by posting on a board than taking up arms.

AP: Attacks, Praise Stretch Truth At GOP Convention



ST. PAUL, Minn. — Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin and her Republican supporters held back little Wednesday as they issued dismissive attacks on Barack Obama and flattering praise on her credentials to be vice president. In some cases, the reproach and the praise stretched the truth.

Some examples:

PALIN: "I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending ... and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress 'thanks but no thanks' for that Bridge to Nowhere."

THE FACTS: As mayor of Wasilla, Palin hired a lobbyist and traveled to Washington annually to support earmarks for the town totaling $27 million. In her two years as governor, Alaska has requested nearly $750 million in special federal spending, by far the largest per-capita request in the nation. While Palin notes she rejected plans to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to an island with 50 residents and an airport, that opposition came only after the plan was ridiculed nationally as a "bridge to nowhere."

PALIN: "There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it's easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform _ not even in the state senate."

THE FACTS: Compared to McCain and his two decades in the Senate, Obama does have a more meager record. But he has worked with Republicans to pass legislation that expanded efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to help destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. The legislation became law last year. To demean that accomplishment would be to also demean the work of Republican Sen. Richard Lugar of Indiana, a respected foreign policy voice in the Senate. In Illinois, he was the leader on two big, contentious measures in Illinois: studying racial profiling by police and requiring recordings of interrogations in potential death penalty cases. He also successfully co-sponsored major ethics reform legislation.

PALIN: "The Democratic nominee for president supports plans to raise income taxes, raise payroll taxes, raise investment income taxes, raise the death tax, raise business taxes, and increase the tax burden on the American people by hundreds of billions of dollars."

THE FACTS: The Tax Policy Center, a think tank run jointly by the Brookings Institution and the Urban Institute, concluded that Obama's plan would increase after-tax income for middle-income taxpayers by about 5 percent by 2012, or nearly $2,200 annually. McCain's plan, which cuts taxes across all income levels, would raise after tax-income for middle-income taxpayers by 3 percent, the center concluded.
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Obama would provide $80 billion in tax breaks, mainly for poor workers and the elderly, including tripling the Earned Income Tax Credit for minimum-wage workers and higher credits for larger families.

He also would raise income taxes, capital gains and dividend taxes on the wealthiest. He would raise payroll taxes on taxpayers with incomes above $250,000, and he would raise corporate taxes. Small businesses that make more than $250,000 a year would see taxes rise.

MCCAIN: "She's been governor of our largest state, in charge of 20 percent of America's energy supply ... She's responsible for 20 percent of the nation's energy supply. I'm entertained by the comparison and I hope we can keep making that comparison that running a political campaign is somehow comparable to being the executive of the largest state in America," he said in an interview with ABC News' Charles Gibson.

THE FACTS: McCain's phrasing exaggerates both claims. Palin is governor of a state that ranks second nationally in crude oil production, but she's no more "responsible" for that resource than President Bush was when he was governor of Texas, another oil-producing state. In fact, her primary power is the ability to tax oil, which she did in concert with the Alaska Legislature. And where Alaska is the largest state in America, McCain could as easily have called it the 47th largest state _ by population.

MCCAIN: "She's the commander of the Alaska National Guard. ... She has been in charge, and she has had national security as one of her primary responsibilities," he said on ABC.

THE FACTS: While governors are in charge of their state guard units, that authority ends whenever those units are called to actual military service. When guard units are deployed to Iraq or Afghanistan, for example, they assume those duties under "federal status," which means they report to the Defense Department, not their governors. Alaska's national guard units have a total of about 4,200 personnel, among the smallest of state guard organizations.

FORMER ARKANSAS GOV. MIKE HUCKABEE: Palin "got more votes running for mayor of Wasilla, Alaska than Joe Biden got running for president of the United States."

THE FACTS: A whopper. Palin got 616 votes in the 1996 mayor's election, and got 909 in her 1999 re-election race, for a total of 1,525. Biden dropped out of the race after the Iowa caucuses, but he still got 76,165 votes in 23 states and the District of Columbia where he was on the ballot during the 2008 presidential primaries.

FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOV. MITT ROMNEY: "We need change, all right _ change from a liberal Washington to a conservative Washington! We have a prescription for every American who wants change in Washington _ throw out the big-government liberals, and elect John McCain and Sarah Palin."

THE FACTS: A Back-to-the-Future moment. George W. Bush, a conservative Republican, has been president for nearly eight years. And until last year, Republicans controlled Congress. Only since January 2007 have Democrats have been in charge of the House and Senate.

AP: Attacks, Praise Stretch Truth At GOP Convention

If it’s a moot point why does McCain bring up his POW experience every single time he speaks?

I was saying that I don't consider fighting for your country can be done through a post on a message board.

__________________
" Even though life can be a very long, hard, stressful and never-ending journey, never lose hope in what you want the most."

The moot point is that the nit pickiness about his service. He served and he should bring it up..what military experience has Obama done for our country? I would rather a former POW as commander in chief than someone with no experience.

__________________
" Even though life can be a very long, hard, stressful and never-ending journey, never lose hope in what you want the most."

[quote=truble2301;3040568]Yes, I don't think you should criticize someone's military experience.

__________________
" Even though life can be a very long, hard, stressful and never-ending journey, never lose hope in what you want the most."

Just an observation--but when someone, anyone, uses their military experience as a basis for people to vote for them, you damn skippy it should be scrutinized and criticized if needed!

I would bet that Gen. Wesley Clarke wouldn't care if someone scrutinized his service, or Colin Powell for the matter! (would love it if the two of them ran--either together or seperate!!! )

McCain does not get to pull the "I am a veteran and was a POW" card without expecting some backlash--just like Palin can't use the gender card and Obama can't use the race card. How would you feel if everytime you turned around Biden was using "I'm a widower" as a reason to vote for him/his ticket??

__________________
"In life it is so hard to know which bridges to cross and which bridges to burn....."

[quote=momtolfi;3040675]Me either!

__________________
Ana
The Republicans have been putting lipstick on a pig for 8 years. Is a pitbull wearing lipstick an attempt to keep us from noticing the pig?

Do you see us as a nation that must always be at war? Is that why our president needs to be skilled in killing people and breaking things?

A nation must not always be a war, but it MUST ALWAYS be prepared to be at war. Moreover, rather than simplifying the military and indicating they merely "kill people and break things" it would be more accurate to say they have and continue to liberate millions of people, bring much needed medical treatment to people, build infrastructure, build schools, build water plants, bring aid to people in countries hit by natural disasters, bring aid to our countrymen in time of natural disasters, etc. I think it's really sad and misinformed that our military is just a force to "kill people and break things."

__________________
Proud Wife of an Army Soldier and proud mother of an Army MP currently serving in Iraq.


"To any critics who say a woman can't think and work and carry a baby at the same time, I'd just like to escort that Neanderthal back to the cave." - Sarah Palin

If military experience matters, she must have voted for Kerry over Bush then, right?

While I don't think the US should be the ones to liberate millions (why should we always have to be the hero? KWIM?) I agree with everything else.

It's not just sad and misinformed to label the military personnel as only killing people and breaking things--it is incredibly disrespectful to the men and women who have chosen to volunteer to protect me and you. Not happy w/ the statment "kill people and break things"! Very disrespectful!!

Lack of respect (and yes, I'm talking to both "sides) is a big reason why our country can't fix some of the problems we have. The atmosphere is so partisian that one side won't acknowledge that the other side might possibly have a good idea or *gasp* be right about something!

Frankly, I'm just disgusted with the whole mess! I'm not asking that everyone agree or even get along--but my God, can't we at least respect one another and be civil?

__________________
"In life it is so hard to know which bridges to cross and which bridges to burn....."

And More.....


"Maverick Misleads September 4, 2008
A McCain ad comparing Palin to Obama isn't all above board.

Summary
McCain's campaign launched a TV ad touting his running mate, Palin, and offering a comparison to Obama. Some of its claims are off the mark:

It says Obama "gave big oil billions in subsidies and giveaways," citing his votes for a 2005 energy bill. But the bill slightly raised taxes on the oil industry overall.

The ad plucked a positive blurb about Palin from an Associated Press article that, in fact, was very much a mixed review. The AP said she "brings an ethical shadow to the [Republican] ticket," for example.

The ad says Obama is the "most liberal" Senator. But the National Journal rated him the 16th most liberal in his first year and the 10th most liberal in his second. It rated his votes "most liberal" only in 2007, when he was busy campaigning and missed one-third of the votes on which the rating is based."

FactCheck.org: Maverick Misleads

I remember hearing that when McCain gave information he gave alot of nonsense stuff to make them happy. Didn't he give sports stats when they wanted info with numbers? I think I remember that.

You might want to read his books. Of course, those "facts" are probably subject to change as well.