please just go away.....

I am a Republican. BUT, if this man becomes the nominee, I will not vote for him. I won't vote for Hillary, but, oh man I hate to say this, I would vote for Obama over Romney.

There is just something about that guy that totally creeps me out.......



on another subject....

I got an email today from my best friend. It was about Obama and his Muslim past. Very dark and scary, so I googled it. It doesn't seem to be true, but she totally fell for it. I need to enlighten her....

but if he were "more muslim" would you all vote for him? just curious where ppl might stand on that.

I too, agree with you about Mitt Romney. I think he's slicker than a snake oil salesman, lol. His flip flopping on issues doesn't help either in my opinion.

I as well, would NOT vote for Mitt or Hillary. I also would vote Obama over Mitt! I would like to see a Obama/Edwards ticket. That I wouldn't feel bad about voting for against Huckabee or Romney.

I am voting for Ron Paul in the Florida primary and if he makes it to the general election, he has my vote ten times over.


If Obama were "more Muslim" I guess it would be in the way he showed it. Mixing religion into politics doesn't sit well with me (like Huckabee). When you let your faith make judgements on certain issues, I can't agree with that. I understand having faith in God, but using that in order to steer you one way or another...well, I disagree.

Huckabee used his faith to guide him with pardons. If a minister or pastor was involved in asking for a pardon for an individual, it was often granted.

__________________
Debra
---------------------------
How did we win the election in the year 2000? We talked about a humble foreign policy: No nation-building; don't police the world. That's conservative, it's Republican, it's pro-American - it follows the founding fathers. And, besides, it follows the Constitution.

Do your part, vote RON PAUL in the Republican Primaries!
www.RonPaul2008.com

As a Democrat, I find Romney to be the least offensive candidate that the GOP has to offer. I know that he has changed his policy positions on many issues, but a Republican candidate would have to in order to appeal to the new base. I think he's a very intelligent man and rational. He has also proven himself to be a competent businessman and governor. I also think that he would do what he says he would do. The fact that he is a Mormon doesn't bother me one bit. He and his family can only be described as wholesome. He compares favorably to Huckabee and Guliani and even McCain in that department. I wouldn't vote for him because I believe that he would try to keep his campaign promises.

Obama is not a Muslim, but it wouldn't bother me if he were.

i would have a hard time calling obama a christian.

Don't feel bad, I bet he'd feel the same way about you.

why? His church is more centered around Africa than the Lord. But I'm sure you already knew that.

And where did you come upon that information? Under or over the bridge?

Looked up this info....thought I would post it here.

Summary of the eRumor:
The eRumor says that the Trinity Church of Christ in Chicago, Senator Barack Obama's home church, has a "non-negotiable commitment to Africa" and that only African Americans are admitted for membership.

The Truth:
Senator Barack Obama has been a member of Chicago's Trinity Church of Christ since 1988.

As a result of Obama's candidacy for president, Trinity Church has come under scrutiny. Critics have accused the church of being racist. Supporters say the congregation is proudly black and with a strong linkage and commitment to its African roots. That's a matter of heritage, they say, not a lack of commitment to being Americans.
The "About Us" page at the church's web site says the church is "Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian... Our roots in the Black religious experience and tradition are deep, lasting and permanent. We are an African people, and remain 'true to our native land,' the mother continent, the cradle of civilization."

There is no wording about a "non-negotiable commitment to Africa."

Because of its black emphasis, the church is overwhelmingly black but there is no requirement to be African-American for membership.

Updated 12/27/07

__________________
Debra
---------------------------
How did we win the election in the year 2000? We talked about a humble foreign policy: No nation-building; don't police the world. That's conservative, it's Republican, it's pro-American - it follows the founding fathers. And, besides, it follows the Constitution.

Do your part, vote RON PAUL in the Republican Primaries!
www.RonPaul2008.com

I would NEVER vote for Osama oh I mean Obama Hussein, not in this lifetime....oh that man scares me, he talks but he says NOTHING!!! Sherri

__________________
"It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

How childish.

Oh my, I'm actually going to kind of agree with a certain poster!!

Even in the description of Obama's Church, it does seem they center around Africa and heritage as opposed to God.

I guess that kind of confirms something I've kind of felt about Obama and not been able to put my finger on. I feel like his race may over shadow the Presidency like it does God in his church.



and truble...........why leave a comment like that? You don't like what a poster says, debate it, don't attack the poster. Things have been so nice around here.....

Church members are "Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian... " I expect the acknowledgement and pride in their heritage is not much different then members of, for instance, a Greek Orthordox Church.

As for the suggestion to debate rather then comment, exactly how would a rational person debate such a remark. IMO, the description of the poster's comment as "childish" was spot on.

why bother saying "unashamedly black" I don't get it. I know that is probably because I've been white all my life, and I realize the my experiences are limited. I just think that that will seep into his presidency, and I don't see that as a good thing. my opinion, that's all.

And I don't take pride in my church that way. In fact there is little "pride" involved in my faith.
Do you think that if there were another person running for office and their church was "Unahamedly Caucasion" ppl would be offended by that?

Please know, I am not racist, that's not where this is coming from. Just concerm for what I read there.




And maybe in your opinion it was childish. Some ppl have a hard time expressing themselves, or different ways of doing so. Why judge one another so harshly? Don't like the post? move on.....I do it most of the time....

I think I'm missing something, I don't see the linkage you do between members being unashamedly African and pride in their church. I interpret the pride in their African heritage as a good thing. Pride in one's heritage is fairly common and I think reinforcing that feeling is a good thing. Just a few generations ago African Americans were considered second class citizens in this country, just as the Irish were a few generations prior.

I don't see where the term "pride" in the church comes in. Members say they are "Unapologetically Christian"; so am I and proud of it. Again, I don't think that's a bad trait. As far as people being offended by a church being ""Unahamedly Caucasion", the church in question does not have a requirement that members be of African heritage so I don't think that concern applies. BTW, I have no doubt that there are white and black churches that do have that requirement but it doesn't apply in this scenerio.

As for "some ppl have a hard time expressing themselves ... ." I don't think the poster had a "hard time" coming up with such a juvenile play on the Senator's name. Usually I do try to "move on" but this time, like you, I chose to join the fray.

Same reason you felt compelled to comment on it. Twice. I wanted to.

There was a time when Black people could not worship in the same CHRISTIAN churches that white people worshiped in. If they wanted to worship the Lord, they had to have their own churches. Where I have lived, I have seen Korean Christian Churches, Polish Christian Churches and so on. You get my dirift? Would you criticize a candidate because he was Polish and belonged to a Polish congregation? I do not believe that Obama should be criticized for belonging to a church that has been historically necessary. I have not seen anything that could be considered his race overshadowing anything.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

The Mormon church, for one.

Great, great, great post! Completely agree!

Thanks, Truble. The Mormon Church allowed black people to attend church with them, they just taught that in the afterlife, they would be slaves in heaven. They taught that black people could join the church but could not hold the priesthood or go to the temple which is necessary for ""exhaltation" to the highest level in heaven and Godhood. Until 1978, people of color could worship with the Mormons (LDS) but were not equal.

But, that is not the reason for my not voting for Mitt Romney. I do not want another president that believes he is a God, going to be a God, was a God or could be a God. I want a president who is grounded in truth and I can trust his reasoning skills. I have to trust that he is able to critically think, not emotionally think. I have had enough of silly thinking presidents. JMHO!

As always, YMMV!

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

There were several components to Atwater's Southern strategy, but at the heart of every bit of it was racism. All it did was foster irrational fears, hatred and injustice.

When I read a comment such as this one, "why bother saying "unashamedly black" I don't get it. I know that is probably because I've been white all my life, and I realize the my experiences are limited. I just think that that will seep into his presidency, and I don't see that as a good thing. my opinion, that's all. " I see that irrational fear. I see somebody who is so sure there's a black agenda about to be implemented.

I can only hope that the GOP continues to lose elections with "macaca" comments.

Mitt said he watched his father march with MLK. He then recanted, saying he meant it "figuratively".
Uh, yeah right, Mitt.

I don't hold his religious beliefs against him.
Just as I don't hold Obama's Christian beliefs against him.

Too many people to quote so I will just say well said debrah44, ana21, usnamom, kvmj and of course truble2301 (love ya, woman ).

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

Oh Truble I wouldnt expect anything else from you...I have learned to take you with a grain of salt!!!!!! Sherri

__________________
"It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

Well, you are seeing something that is not there. I just feel like we need to start seeing ppl as ppl, not by race. BTW that little baby in my avatar? She's a child of color. I know what I think and how I feel, your suppositions about my opinions can't change reality.

I think we are missing each other on the pride thing. In my mind pride is not a good thing when it comes to my faith, but, I am proud to say that I am a believer in Christ . So I guess I kind of missed the point. However, I do not agree that pride in anything else, inside a church where the focus is supposed to be Christ, is ok. We should identify as believers. That's just how I feel. Why continue to separate ourselves?? AND, I would certainly hesitate to become a member of a church that states they are Unashamedly black when I am white. So, I suppose that pretty much keeps white membership down, or any other race for that matter.

Absolutely.

When you never have to be ashamed of the color of your skin, when you don't ever have to worry that you will be judged unfairly or unkindly by the color of your skin, then the color of your skin won't be a concern. Because you are white, you and your ancestors have not had to worry that because of the color of their skin, they were being prejudged. There was a time in America, Christian America when being a person of color was something to be ashamed of. You were not equal anywhere and no one really cared. It was what it was. So it doesn't ever bother me for someone of color to say they are unashamedly Black.

Put yourself in a Muslim country where they crucified Christians. You, for years had to defend your beliefs. It was impossible for you to worship, for you to buy property, for you or your children to learn, for you to ride on the bus near the front, for you to vote, for you to hold office, for you to be thought of as equal because of something that you didn't have control over.....your belief in Christ. (this isn't really a fair argument because color of one's skin really isn't in anyone's control, but you see where I am going with this?).

Suddenly, you are told that you are equal. Christians are okay. You have the right to belong to any church that would have you. You can now sit anywhere you want. But you have been attending your church with your Christian borthers and sisters and it is a congregation and belief of which you are proud of. You name it the ________Christian Church. Should you change the name and intent so it offends the muslims less?

A totally hypothetical question and one that seems implausible but if anyone here gets what I am saying, please say it clearer. It really gets me when people don't understand why people of color would have a church or a club with their name in it. The history to me is so clear as to why. It doesn't bother me. I understand it.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Then what, exactly, is your fear of an unashamedly black man who is also proud of his Christianity becoming the president?

By the way, Obama is also a child of color by your definition.

I don't have a "fear" I just think that we cannot continue to separate ourselves and have different rules for different groups of ppl. I think it propagates racism, it doesn't help it.

Faith is of mixed race........including Brazilian, Caucasion, and Black and who knows what else. My choice of defining her as a "child of color" was just a choice. And do you really think that I didn't know that Obama was a child of color? Is "child of color" a politically incorrect term?? Was I using it inappropriately??

I understand where you are coming from, but I have difficulty using religion vs. color, I mean wrapping my tired, blonde brain around it!! lol And you are right, because I've never walked in those shoes, it is hard for me. But I have seen racism in action. I've been with black friends and seen the difference in service, my husband quit our local volunteer fire department, in part because o fthe racism. I know it exists, I just worry that continuing to separate will not help. I have heard the issues of racist ppl that I know and a good deal has to do with feeling like the separation has gone too far.

And I want to say I am not offended by the name of Obama's church. I just think it is unneccesary, and only serves to continue to separate us into groups instead of uniting us as people.

I think that it is going to take quite awhile for us to de polarize much less unite. I still have no clues to your objections to Obama's candidacy.

I agree that it will be a long time, but we have to start somewhere and I think that Obama may only lengthen the process, I don't know.

I started this thread saying that I would vote for Obama over Romney, and I'm very conservative.

I don't understand.
You've heard the issues of the racist people you know and they feel like seperation has gone too far....but don't racists like seperation? Why would that be an issue for them?

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

I see what you mean. And really, regardless, they would probably take issue with different races. I was just saying that they feel they are losing opportunities because of things like affirmative action. Maybe, if we started backing off they would have less to complain about. And I know that even though they talk the way they do about blacks in particular, they continue to have relationships with ppl of different races, good relationships. So, if we stop putting ourselves in categories like that, maybe it we would begin to see a change. I don't know really how to communicate what I'm getting at. I'm so much better at this in person. lol

So back off to make the racists happy, so they won't complain? No thanks.
Like you said, regardless, they would probably still take issue with different races.

We will always categorize people. Rich, poor. Tall, short. Male, female. Heterosexual, homosexual. Republican, Democrat. Blonde, brunette. It's not necessarily a bad thing. Heck, you even did that when you described the child pictured in your avatar. What was it you said: she's "Brazilian, Caucasion, and Black", "child of color". Isn't that categorizing her? Why not just say she is a person? You see ppl as ppl, right?

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

Who has difference rules for different groups of people?

How do you feel about a woman president? I'm not just talking about Hillary but just having a woman in general as president. I am not sure if it would the worst thing that could happen. However I really (I my own opinion) think maybe the US is not ready or open minded enough for a mixed race president. I don't think much of Obama as a candidate and I am a self proclaimed Democrat. As things look at this moment in time I may be forced to skip voting. Just simply because I am not impressed with any of the candidates and do not feel any of them are up to the job at hand.

__________________
"It took me 15 years to get 3,000 hits in baseball. It only took one afternoon on the golfcourse." Babe Ruth

From your post it seems apparent that you're not ready or open minded enough for either a candidate of color or a woman. I do think that most of the nation is ready, or at least resigned to the fact , that it might happen.


That's one of the most egregious and inane statements I have ever read. If you're forced to not vote, it leaves the door open for a candidate you deplore to win. How is that better?

__________________
bite me and get a brain!

I am not ready for a mixed race president and yes I think it would be a bad thing. If you don't like my opinion then Bite me and get a brain. Not every person has to agree with you! A woman would be fine with me as long as she is not a republican.
Have a wonderful day.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion but I am curious as to why "you" are not ready for a mixed race president. In an earlier post you said you didn't think the country was ready. I disagree. I'm also wondering why you think having a mixed race candidate would be a "bad thing". Again, you're entitled to your opinion and I don't want to start an argument, I'm just curious about your reasoning.

What on earth would be a bad thing about a mixed race president?

Suppose instead of Obama it were Colin Powell running? I would never vote for Obama (I don't like him and don't trust him), but if Colin Powell were running I would vote for him in a heartbeat! As for a woman president, I simply don't like Hillary (never have) and I don't think she has the experience to be president. Plus I think she would try to make our country more 'government-run' and take away citizens' rights.

I don't see anything wrong with a mixed race or a woman president. I just think the wrong ones are running!

I would have possibly voted for General Powell pre-2002. I lost all respect for him since he either was misled about the Iraq WMD situation in which case he should fess up and say so or he lied like the rest of the bunch who supported the Iraq invasion.

As for Senator Clinton making the country more "government run" and taking away citizens' rights -- have you been paying attention the last 7 years?

I agree. I lost all respect for Powell (and John McCain) when they puckered up to kiss you-know-whose butt on Iraq and completely lied to the country and the world. Disgusting behavior.

As for the second comment -- could you BE any more correct? I don't think so!

I agree about Powell and McCain. I also think it's about time Powell had something to tell the American people. Why is he protecting these jerks?

No administration has ever done more to undermine the constitution than this crew.

I am not sure that Obama is running as a "mixed race" candidate. I am pretty sure that most of America does not think of him as a "mixed race" candidate and your comment says much more about you than it says about Obama. Does him being mixed mean that he is not quite as smart as someone who is either or? Is that what you are saying. I am really curious as to what would possess you to say this. I understand that this is your opinion and you are entititled to it but when you post something like this, you must have some reasoning behind it. Are there polls that I haven't seen? The only polls I have seen about this have been whether America is ready for a Woman or a Black president. Those seem to be the issue.

Perhaps you could clarify your position.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

There is no need for me to try and explain you all have your views and I have mine. If you don't like what I say than so be it. I come from the old school. That is where I stand like it or not. I am raising my children the same way my parents and their parents raised them. You do what you like and keep your nose and opinions out of my yard.

Well golly, perhaps it is best that you skip voting as you said you might do in your first post inquiring about "our" opinion on a woman president.

As an aside, does anyone else think we may be getting "PUM'd"?

Heaven knows, I hope so! I'd hate to think that kind of thinking is for real!

The old school of what? Bigotry? Racism? Anti-men with big ears?

I do not agree with it...but I thing she means the "old-school" fundamental Christian views (especially Baptists) and others that marrying of different races is not accepted. I have heard preachers black and white say the same thing when I was growing up.

That old school wouldn't have uniforms made of white sheets and pointy hats, would it?

You are right, you are entitled to your opinion, no matter how closed minded and idiotic it is. I don't call it old school, I call it silly and bigoted and I feel for your children. And for you....you must hate living here in the US, the melting pot, the land of everyone is free to be with whom they want. I feel for you.

By the way, just an FYI, if you post a question on a public board, be prepared to take the flack from any silly post you make, be prepared to defend your opinions no matter what they are. You shouldn't be defensive, if what you believe you really have reasons to believe it.

I hope we are being PUM'd. I would hate to think there are people today that consider racism and bigotry as "old school" beliefs.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

"land of everyone is free to be with whom they want." Practice what you preach. I do not believe in mixed marriages that is my belief just like you believe it is fine. I am white and want my family to stay that way. I found a white man that wants me and did not have to look else where. I have never owned another person and will not pay for some one else's choice. If you want to preach then please feel free because as you stated this is the land of the free. I am free to feel and believe as I do. You are also closed minded and an idiot think every person should think and feel as you.
Why don't you talk with some of the people that made this country, people in their elder years you will find that I am not alone. Don't try to force your views on me I am not trying to force mine on you. The people on this board ask me to explain and I did. I feel the way I do you feel your way. Leave it at that.

[quote=dlampe;2943351 ... I am white and want my family to stay that way. I found a white man that wants me and did not have to look else where. ...[/QUOTE]


Yep, we've been PUM'd.

Couple more posts and we'll be hearing about the bambinos!

Well, as far as the "Baptist" comment goes..........I happen to attend a Baptist church, but I certainly am not against mixed marriages. People are people, there are far more differences that should keep us from marrying another person than the color of our skin. I know that God made us all equal.

The Baptist comment..was meant that is how 40+ years ago I was taught in a Baptist church. Also the black Baptist churches here at that time taught the same thing. I did not mean any offense to Baptists..but you can't change history.Some people still believe it..I also stated that I did not agree with it.
I was only pointing out a reason why people may think this way, is because of their upbringing.
You have to remember a big group of people that vote are over the age of 60 that was brought up thinking this. It does not make it right but that is a fact that we have to deal with.

I will pray for you and your white man. I have one, too. They are great aren't they? Luckily, we didn't feel the need to qualify our relationship by the color of our skin. Just something that my church and the Lord taught us. We looked beneath the skin to our hearts and found that our hearts beat the same color of blood, Our children have been taught the same way. Hopefully, your kids will ignore all racist teachings about color and owning people (where did that come from????) and find someone they love and who loves them irregardless of the color of their skin. That is what America is about. The freedom to choose because of the content of someones heart not the color of their skin.

Oh, yeah, say hello to your bambinos!

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Oh, honey, all you had to do was to tell us that you're a racist and we would have understood completely. No need to get your (presumably white) panties in a wad.

Omigosh!!!! Hysterical.

Hmmm. I just popped in and thought I would actually have to respond to this..........but I see you all have it under control.

Carry on.

__________________
bite me and get a brain!

I'm thinking not so much the old school fundamental Christian view (Baptist, as you said), but more of the deep South ways, i.e., white robes, cross burning. I was raised Baptist and we weren't preached to about mixed races and if a black family came to our church, they were welcome. (This was over 40 years ago). But my BIL is from Mississippi and he still has the 'deep South' way of thinking and much of Mississippi (at least the area he's from) still thinks that way. Heck, they still say the "N" word in just talking and the blacks still call the whites Mister (or Master so and so).... really !!! So I think it's a Deep South thing. Even now he and his family from Mississippi won't watch a sit-com or movie if a black person is in it in a starring role. When my son had a roommate that was black, he was REALLY upset about it!! There's more of this type of thinking than a lot of people from up north realize because they simply haven't been around it.

I know what you are saying, mom2twins......it makes me so sad. I know that my parents had racist tendencies, but they were careful not to pass them on to us because they realized it was wrong. Somtimes you can't help how you feel because of how you were raised, but you don't have to continue it. The older I get the more I understand that ppl can't think a certain way because they have no other experience. Not and excuse, just the way it is. The more we learn, the more we refine our beliefs.

And I don't think this attitude is only in the deep south unfortunately. My husbands uncle is terribly racist, I just don't get it. He's met our baby Faith before and was fine, but I don't know if he realized her heritage. Probably a good thing he didn't make any comments.....it wouldn't really go well I'm sure......the more I consider the day someone does treat her different because of her race, the more upset I get. I don't know how ppl take it.

obama is a muslim who wants to be president of africa

You have been told that this is not true.

PUM, I don't know if you know this or not, but there is no President of Africa. I know that Obama would not be running for president of the US if he wanted to run for president of Africa. It just wouldn't make sense. Does it to you? Maybe you missed that class in your "old school".

Try and not spread things that are in no way possible nor true. There are people on this board who believe the most outrageous things, such as "how important it is to keep the white race pure" and other things like that.

Gosh, you are a fun poster to have around. I need the distraction as my son has deployed and it is the freedoms you and the other "old school" poster that he is defending. I think that is the height of irony. Both of you have the freedom to believe crazy things because my son, a "mixed" Marine Officer is laying down his life for the second tour every day so you can exercise that freedom. He can do that, but he can't marry into your lily white family. Such irony.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Well I am pretty much color blind in real life so the color means nothing to me at all.
All this talk of religion swerving around to tell me how the country will be run makes me queasy..
I think rekigion should stay out of politics all the way around..not dictate how a country should be run..or based on one persons faith or lack of. Seperation and all that.
Sex wise don't care either...
All I am interested in is IF they can do the job that needs to be done..I don't care what color or sex they are, nor if they bang a gong or kneel for their religion.
My dream runner would be a black atheist lesbian
But I dont see that one happening..roflmao
People get all hung up on the craziest things while losing sight of the bigger picture...
The whole country was going down the tubes in various directions..and guess what..they sidetracked everyone on gay marriage..
Yeppers..if we take that option away all will be right with the world..
And the sun rotates around the earth...

__________________
"Cast upon this globe without physical strength or innate ideas, incapable in himself of obeying fundamental laws of this nature which call him to the supreme place in the universe, it is only in the heart of society that man can attain the pre-eminent position which is his natural destiny. Without the aide of civilization he would be one of the feeblest and least intelligent of animals.."
Jean-Marc-Gaspard Itard

In a wheel chair.

Let's just cover all our bases at once and be done with it. Oh and maybe a tranny to boot. Wouldn't that be a hoot?

Works for me..at least they would be real to me

__________________
"Cast upon this globe without physical strength or innate ideas, incapable in himself of obeying fundamental laws of this nature which call him to the supreme place in the universe, it is only in the heart of society that man can attain the pre-eminent position which is his natural destiny. Without the aide of civilization he would be one of the feeblest and least intelligent of animals.."
Jean-Marc-Gaspard Itard

my bambino was saying you would like sadaam to run for president if he wasn't dead already

Who had had an abortion when she was 21....

__________________
Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"