so do I. well at least what you are doing right now.

Obama, speaking on ABC's Good Morning America

"If they think that they're gonna try to make Michelle an issue in this campaign, they should be careful. Because, that I find unacceptable.
The notion that you start attacking my wife or my family you know,...
... I think is just low class. "



Know when to draw the line. And if you don't "know", then LEARN from your candidate's own words.

X

Great point, OP.

But don't you know -- it doesn't 'apply' to the rant on Republicans!! It's a free-for-all on Gov. Palin and McCain. Guess it's 'new blood' in the water and they go at it like sharks!

Who is attacking McCain's or Palin's family? My heart aches for her poor 17 year old. The issues today are surrounding Palin's and McCain's decision making skills.

Governor Palin is the candidate and fair game -- don't see one criticism of daughter, just her daughter's mother -- Governor Palin.

__________________
Ana
The Republicans have been putting lipstick on a pig for 8 years. Is a pitbull wearing lipstick an attempt to keep us from noticing the pig?

Logic, again? Silly Ana!

It is amazing how Obama's supporters do not tend to take "the high road" that he talks about.

That he wasn't going to play the dirty tricks that goes with running a campaign.

Dirty tricks?? What dirty tricks -- is baby daddy a democratic plant?

__________________
Ana
The Republicans have been putting lipstick on a pig for 8 years. Is a pitbull wearing lipstick an attempt to keep us from noticing the pig?

What "dirty trick" are you referring to?

Honestly, I could care less that she is pregnant except for the irony of it all. My whole point is I will not be surprised if they use this as an excuse for her to step down.

I was thinking about when Obama termed Republican leaning bloggers posting about smears (such as rev. wright, etc) as dirty tricks. Even though the info, was true.

Link, please.

' Proving my point that no answer will be sufficient, so why waste anyone's time? "

cpsfsisooi

McCain KNEW about Palins daughter before he announced his pick!

So, projecting the beliefs and rantings of a pastor to a presidential candidate and spreading lies around the internet and discussing the very real pregnancy of a candidate's daughter are the same?

Well, you know, for some people, they are.

And this makes his judgment look . . . better???

And you know that how? Because he said so

Despite what the McCain camp is saying, I don't for one minute believe they knew about this pregnancy. I don't think they truly vetted Palin.

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

Well you are all knowing....................

Actually, she is hopeful, because God help us all if this is how he makes one of the most important decisions he can make at this point.

Geezzzzz, I thought we had grown more as a society to not view a teenage pregancy as a disgrace and also not to smear the family because of it. I know this is high profile but if this is the worst thing the Dems can whine about I'm not too worried. Just dissappointed at the levels people fall to..... Would this be such a scandal if the girl was 18 and engaged beforehand? Doubt it.

Was it true that Michelle referred to Whitey supposedly on tape? Don't you think that this is the type of rumor that Obama is referring to? Or, maybe that she hates America? Should I go on?

The stuff about Rev Wright was true same as Palin daughter's pregrancy is true.
And once again it was not just a causal friends with the Rev. Wright.
It was about the fact that Obama sat though sermons of Rev. Wright.

Actually, yes. Considering the platform of the party her parent represents.

Pregnant, poor, knocked up? horrible welfare recipient pull yourself up by your own damn bootstraps. Pregnant, rich, and knocked up? Oh happy day .... Oh, the irony

Such distortions going on here, it's like playing a game of Twister!

I have sat though sermons I don't agree with. That doesn't mean I would have all the same values and beliefs as the preacher. That was the smear. to project those thoughts and values on Mr. Obama just because his paster had them.

Saying Palin knew and encouraged her daughter to be sexually active before marriage just by the fact her kid is pregnant would be a smear.

No, I believe that honor belongs to you.
Like I said above, I said "I believe" and "I think". I never said, "I know", Ms. 99%. lol. Chill out. It's just a test.

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

__________________

Reading is Fundamental.

THAT still scares me. I went on that website before Obama got really popular and it was so blatantly racist I still shudder. The list of the tenants of the church were all black this and black that. Had that been a church stating white this and white this.....about a white politician you think he'd be where Obama is? SInce then the website has DRAMATICALLY changed. Gee, I wonder why? lol

It's called being responsible. That's what the Republican party stands for. So yes, I would tend to agree with your statement in that if you are poor and pregnant you do need to pull yourself up and try to make a better life. Since when is that bad? If you are financially stable then your life will be easier.

I'm chilled, thank you for your concern. And test away, I'm not afraid like some people on here....

Oh concerned would not be my feelings towards you. LOL.

You bet. It will be fun to throw out words and phrases and then backpedal with the "I'm just kidding" act.

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

I'm still not scared........my beliefs are firmly rooted. A liberal (yes, I'm assuming) admitting they dont' have "concerned" feelings toward someone with an opposite view. I'm so shocked!!!! My day is just ruined!

Take the politics out of the equation:
A 40something y/o mother w/ a 4 month old special needs child, a teenage girl who is pregnant, a son who is being deployed--can any of you actually think that she NEEDS to devote her time and energy on anything other than her family?

Being driven and ambitious is one thing--it's what has gotten women out of the house and into the working world, it's what has gotten women "off their backs". But you can be too ambitious, and too driven.

And when ambition and drive could be detrimental to your family--then one has to question which way your moral compass points!(notice this sentence does not use gender--it applies to men, like John Edwards for example, as well as women.)

__________________
Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Over 8 MILLION people signed an online petition to cancel a PRETEND television show, Zoey, when the star became pregnant. Mind you, she never appeared pregnant on the show.

Concerned Parents Need To Boycott Nickelodeon Advertisers Until Zoey 101 Is Cancelled

Now, I can guess the very same organizations and groups that promoted the signing of that petition are the very ones who now say "You go girl!" But, of course, that is just a guess. As I recall, lots of horrible things were said about her family (mother) as well.

Additionally, no one is smearing the family. Some of DO question the decisions of the family in light of the negative effect this will have on the poor girl.

Quite frankly, I am thrilled - this is a great example of why abstinence only programs don't work. I am glad she did not contract HIV, of course, we don't really know she didn't.

Not sure why you are putting quotes around the word concerned. You were the one that assumed I would feel that way towards you. I was simply correcting you and letting you know that's far from the truth.
Oh okay. Well like you tell others, chill out. lol

Yes, I remember that.

__________________
@@@
l/ l/ l/
Dont go through life,
GROW through life

Real eyes...realize...real lies.

I was being sarcastic about the "concerned" word.
A boycott of a show that might glamourize teen pregnancy on a teen show makes sense. I don't think anyone glamourized Gov. Palins daughter. This is a real life situation as opposed to some fuzzy tv show for impressionable young people.

Thank you. That is exactly my point.

Oh, Kathy, you never quit surprising me. A few months ago we discussed why the church was proud of being African and had lots of support for being black. It used the words black in the "tenants" of the church because it has a mainly black congregation. In olden times, I am sure you remember those days, black people were not allowed to join just any congregation. It was understood that all the churches were white and black people had to have their own church to worship. Hence, the African American.....Methodist, Baptist, whatever church. I wouldn't call it racist any more than I can call the Vietnamese Catholic Church racist or the Polish Evangelical church racist.

Now, we all know who and what constitutes racist beliefs because I copied and pasted a definition on the thread where we learned about AA baby names. Did you read it?

On topic more......I agree with Obama Barack re: leaving the families out of the race. He said it weeks ago about his own wife and some people came out and said that she knew what she was getting into when he decided to run for office so she had better come correct and live with the scrutiny....and boy did she get scrutinized. Either we leave the families out of it on both sides or you don't. Which is it?

We either forget what the Conservatives think Michelle looks like when she gave a speech at the convention, her pride in being an American, her "angry black woman vibe" and we forget about the little boy with DS and her daughter failing to not listen to her mother (if her mother did this and I don't know but i have a feeling that she did) advising her to not have premarital sex or she might get pregnant.

Either way, I am glad that she was chosen. Talk about a mistake for John McCain! I am betting some heads will roll pretty soon over there in Republican headquarters for not doing an accurate background check. I don't think that that she knew her daughter was pregnant at the time or it wasn't told to John McCain. How exactly does this help his campaign?

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

If the website wasn't offensive why was it dramatically changed????? Enough said!
The daughter is 5 months pregnant so I would bet the mom knew. The girl's not heavy so it would be pretty hard to be hiding it at that point. You seem to convey the thought that conservatives who preach abstinence to their children are exempt from any problems. That's not very realistic is it? Do you think children of conservatives aren't also just regular kids who are going to make mistakes? Do you reallly hold us in such high regard that now that you know Ms. Palins daughter is pregnant out of wedlock you are shocked?? Maybe you respect us more than you think! It helps the campaign because she and her family live the pro-life message.

Well we all know Barack wouldnt want to PUNISH his daughters with a baby........So if one of his children got pregnant...off to the nearest abortion clinic he would go........................ I applaud Palin's daughter, she could have just killed that baby and not gone throught all this..........Barack Obama Would Back Daughters' Abortion, "Don't Punish Them With a Baby". Sherri

__________________
"It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

My guess is this won't happen because the Obama's accept the reality of the world we live in and provide his daughters adequate information to get birth control rather than to play Russian roulett if, in fact, the daughters decide to go against their advice to not be sexually active. Not only that, Mr. Obama will promote sex education in schools and making birth control available because he doesn't deny the reality that some kids are sexually active. And, news flash, he wants fewer abortions, too.

We people without good ol "conservative family values" accept the reality of what may happen despite our best intentions and don't stick our heads in the sand and deny reality, and we certainly don't wish to prevent other kids from getting information to help them prevent unwanted pregnancy other than "don't do it.'

Thus, fewer abortions, which is really what we ALL want, isn't it?

I certainly hope the girl is being watched 24/7. If I were her, with all this going on, I might be tempted to jump off a bridge or something. Poor kid.

My goodness you'd think she had an incurable disease.........She has a loving family for heavens sake. I'm sure they are all used to a little bit of the limelight since she has been the governor. They aren't living under a rock. Maybe, by now, the family is actually EXCITED about the new baby. What a novel idea!!!!

[quote=nightowlrn;3039234]We people without good ol "conservative family values" accept the reality of what may happen despite our best intentions and don't stick our heads in the sand and deny reality, and we certainly don't wish to prevent other kids from getting information to help them prevent unwanted pregnancy other than "don't do it.'

QUOTE]

Sex education in the schools is NOT working. All it does is tell you it's ok to want instant gratification and to do whatever makes you feel good. That really doesn't make for healthy, responsible individuals. If it worked we wouldn't have so many unwanted pregnancies. No birth control method is 100% effective except abstinence. And yes, abstinence is very hard. Just because it's hard to do doesn't mean it's not a good thing to do and it should be promoted. Virginity should be valued and promoted.

I am sure the website was changed because ignorant people who don't know history might think that it was racist. You did.

I might believe the mom knew before, but I am betting that John McCain didn't know. I don't know how he could have known about this and thought this was a good idea....a mom with a baby and an unwed teen aged pregnant daughter. Think about it. Do you really think that was on the list of attributes he thought he was presenting......

I don't think that children of conservatives are not going to make mistakes any more than children of liberal families. But that isn't the question. It is that this is the candidate who when presented her as a VP was thought to have the perfect little family, she was being held up as a paragon of a family values family. I know perfectly well that these things happen but I also know that if Chelsea Clinton had gotten pregnant, the more conservative people on this board, would have crucified the Clintons.

The talk show idiots have been saying that the unwed mother boom in Hollywood has contributed to the moral decay in our youth. So, it would stand to reason that they would cringe at the thought of one of their own has a child (and she is a child) doing that same thing.

And, I would never want my child to marry because she was pregnant and especially not at 17. If that was the plan and everyone knew all along, they could have spared all the scrutiny by having the young couple marry three months ago when surely she told her parents, right? Tells me that they didn't know.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Isn't it funny that Dan Quayle, the second most unqualified VP candidate ever, railed against the fictional unwed motherhood of Murphy Brown, an adult with financial security and an extensive support network of friends as being a terrible example? Gosh, I'd love to hear what Dan has to say about Bristol Palin right about now.

[quote=kathytheshopper;3039239]This is a complcated issue. I think we would ALL agree to that. Barack Obama's own mother was only 18 when she had him, and she didn't even raise him the whole time. He seems to have turned out very well, by all accounts. I can only imagine the crucifying that woman faced......first off married to a black man, AND leaving her child with her parents????? However, that was HER choice. I surmise she had "good" parents, since she chose to leave her son with them. The Palins, and many other families in this country, are now faced with a difficult situation. They, as a family, will handle it, and get thru it. It's really none of anyone's business......kind of like the kid on free lunch who buys an ice cream. I do believe people were saying it was none of anyone's business.

As for the sex ed in school failing, I agree. It is failing, right along with teaching math, science, history,etc. You need more than what they teach in school in all subject areas. Anyone that relies on what the schools teach, well, THAT is burying your head in the sand. I take every example, this one included, to show my kids what can and DOES happen when you make a decision, good or bad, in the heat of the moment or not. It doesn't matter if you are a Democrat or a Republican. Each party has good and bad points, and I agree with parts of both parties.

The back and forth bickering over what kind of parent Sara Palin is really just wasted time in my book.

I have no idea what the original question even was, but, I wanted to address this issue. I think it's important that we ALL realize that education begins at home. Sadly, some kids don't get the education at home. Hopefully they can find a good friend or mentor to help them thru things.

BTW, I agree, virginity should be valued and promoted. Not just for reasons of pregnancy, but, also STDs. Not to mention, what child is ready for the intimate relationship that goes with a sexual relationship?? Heck, some adults aren't ready for it.

I just don't see how this reflects on Gov. Palin's ability to be the VP.

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Excellent points, and well-stated. I couldn't agree more.

__________________
"The errors of faith are better than the best thoughts of unbelief." - Thomas Russell

[quote=allinaugust;3039335]I don't think the happenings in her family reflects on her ability to do the job, but, for me, it means that she has so much on her plate and because of that, something will have to get the lesser attention, KWIM? I know that when I worked full time and all my boys were living at home, I found that I could either give 100% to my job or 100% to my kids. I think that is true for every mother. Something will get shortchanged. I, as a mother, would not want to have that something be my baby or my daughter. I really don't think that I am being mean or judgemental of Sen. Palin. And while I agree that the father could and more than likely take up some of the slack, he has a job and has held a job outside of the home their married life.

I know that I thought I could have it all. A family of as many children as i want, and a career outside of the home that would bring me great satisfaction, but I found that I could not give either my 100% attention. I chose my kids at the time. It was the right decision for my family. It may not be for hers and I can accept that but I don't respect it.

I can take the flame as well. What I am saying is that my children come first....before my career.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Frankly, I could care less if her daughter is knocked up and myspace is littered with picks up her boozing it up with her under-age friends. That is a parenting issue.

And to say "well, Obama's mother what young when she had him" is just foolish, too. Last time I checked, his mom wasn't on the ballot, and I don't think he is going to appoint her to the cabinet. Just a hunch...so, that is really a moot point.

The fact of the matter is historically we've held first families to a higher standard, and there has never been a time where they haven't had to sit under the microscope. You hold public office, and there are no "private matters" anymore...that's just how it is. You can't pick and choose what to share and not to share...what is off limits and what is fair game. You choose to put yourself in that arena...it's part of the job....right or wrong...it is part of the job. At the end of the day, I don't really care if JFK was banging movie stars, or that Cheney loves his gay daughter, and I don't care if Bill or Hillary are sleeping in the same bed.

What I do care about is who is going to lead this country effectively and I care just as much about the VP seat as I do who is sitting in the oval office. And what it comes down to for me, is that Biden wins that race hands down. I thin the GOP made a huge error in not choosing someone who could bring more to the table.

__________________
I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

I do not like to respond to political discussions as some are so passionate about their party they can't and won't see any other views..however.....how many of you and I mean honestly how many of you were virgins when you got married? Yes, we all want to teach our children about abstinence or we want our schools to teach birth control. Do either really guarantee less pregnancies?

I went to sex ed, I was taught to use birth control if I was going to have sex. I was told the best method was abstinence, but in the heat of the moment, it was all forgotten. I was 18, but most of my friends were much younger. We were lucky, we didn't get "caught", but my sister did. She was so afraid to tell my parents she actually thought of running away. Can you imagine what Bristol must have been thinking? Her parents are in a spotlight that we can not even imagine and then to have to tell them she is pregnant, knowing it will become so public and possibly ruin her Mom's career, had to be so hard.

Sarah Palin is handling this in the best way she knows how. She sounds like a very strong and organized woman and honestly, don't we all feel women can juggle many more things then men? I think this is minor compared to what she will be dealing with in the next couple of months.

I just wish everyone would focus on the issues on hand and leave the families lives out of it. Just imagine your "secret" being displayed all over the internet....we all have them.

Yeah, but last I checked, no one in my family was running for President/Vice President.

__________________
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

Lucky you. If Bristol's mother gets her way, none of our children will have that education available to them.

__________________

Reading is Fundamental.

Not to be snarky (even though most of the time I am) but one of the issues in play is "family values" and parenting in this country. I didn't make up those buzz words. She CHOSE this role. She CHOSE to put her family in the spot light. This is part of the job. She KNEW this going into it and still CHOSE it. She made the same choice as Obama...he has two young dauighters. Hillary and Bill had to make the same choice when it came to their daughter. Cheney knew there was a chance that his daughter's lifestyle would be put out there when he chose to go down that path. Rondald and Nancy had to deal with the same thing. Jackie O and her kinds dealt with it LONG after they were out of the white house. This is not a new way of doing business in Washington politics.

Palin knew this was going to come out this way. She knew the backlash her 17 year old daughter was going to have to face. She knew that she would become a national target on every news program and gossip website. She chose to walk down this road....and take her family with her.

I don't think it speaks to "family values" when as a parent you chose your own gain above your children....and yes, if it was a Father not a Mother doing this, I would say the same thing. In fact, I might even be more harsh on a man for chosing his political gain above the national - heck, GLOBAL - exposure of his daughter and her right to privacy.

The whole thing is just messy.

And I still think the GOP could have made a wiser decision.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

But, don't you see? Because her mother is a public (very public right now) figure--her "secret" was revealed. Her own mother had a press conference to announce it! Had Gov. Palin CHOSE not to pursue her own ambitions and aspirations--the girl's pregnancy could have remained a private matter. I see (and maybe it's just the mindset I'm in) this as a betrayal of the mother/daughter relationship. I would have been mortified had my mother broadcast my unwed, unplanned pregnancy (yep--I had one, so I know some of the emotions), for the entire world to see.

Chelsea Clinton was "picked on" because she was not the most "beautiful" of teenagers (she went through a pretty awkward period). The Bush twins' college partying was widely publicized (oh, and so was the one twin's wedding). I truly feel sorry for children of politicians. They are held to a higher standard--and their mistakes are national news! They can't just be "kids"....

If a politician chooses to place his/her children in that spotlight, then it makes me wonder about their moral compass.

__________________
Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Amen, sister.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

Sarah Palin did not reveal her daughter's secret. It was no secret where they live.

In Wasilla, Pregnancy Was No Secret - TIME

"People in Wasilla are Alaskan tough, so not only does a thing like teen pregnancy not seem like anyone's damn business, but it's also not seen as the calamity so many people in the lower 48 might think it is"

Like I said before, the Democrats are running scared and are trying to find fault with Gov. Palin any way they can.

Having your hometown of 6,700 people know something about you is exactly like being the news across the country, isn't it?

From your Time article:

So unfair -- and her own mother did it to her.

__________________

Reading is Fundamental.

No, not really. Put the blame where it belongs -- on Bristol. Her mother shouldn't be forced to give up her own dreams because her daughter decided to have sex. Who knows whether it was protected or unprotected sex -- birth control does fail, you know.

BTW, does anyone know who the father of this baby is? Guess the blame goes on him, too.

Just by running they are placing their children in the spotlight.

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Once again, you miss the point. Welcome to the ignore list. You're just too tiresome to deal with anymore. Please, please, please put me on yours.

__________________

Reading is Fundamental.

Well, they didn't need to run very far before finding it. Like I keep saying....the GOP missed out on an opportunity to create a balanced ticket ---- and it has nothing to do with her daughter, only her politics and experience.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

Agreed....but there is a whole world of difference between (and I can't believe I'm saying this) Obama introducing his daughters when he accepted the nomination and Gov. Palin announcing "hey, my 17 y/o daughter is unwed and pregnant"...KWIM?

And I would feel the same had this been on the Dem. side of the aisle. I think that Gov. Palin has done an enomorous disservie to her daughter. I'm actually quite sad for her daughter. And for the prospective father. Was he even given a voice in all this? Did anyone ask his opinion?

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Right back at you. Funny how you put the Republicans on your ignore list. Makes it easier to keep your same mind set. Classic!!!

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

I totally agree on this. It seems the more I find out about Gov. Palin, the more I don't trust Sen. McCain's judgment. She is not qualified to run for VP and she has totally misrepresented herself to the American public.

I found this quite interesting.

The Daily Dish | By Andrew Sullivan

Thank you, thank you, thank you! Tiresome, huh? Just because someone actually confronts you, you can't handle it and you run to your ignore list. Why would I put you on ignore? There's nothing that you say that bothers me.

Again, so classic.

BTW, your list must be getting pretty long, huh?? Before long, you won't have anyone to talk to!

[quote=usnamom;3039396]That post was not my post usanom.
However, I guess we shouldn't have female doctors because they have to be on call and have irregular schedules, etc... And if one of their daughters ends up pregnant at 17 they should resign immediately.

Obama is not qualified to be the President. Hillary would have been but not Obama. And since Obama attended a black liberation chuch for 20 years and acts like he had no idea what the Rev was preaching I don't trust him!!!

[quote=kathytheshopper;3039528]apples to oranges Kathy and you know it.

__________________
Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

[quote=usnamom;3039288]I am sure the website was changed because ignorant people who don't know history might think that it was racist. You did.
QUOTE
Yes I did think it was racist BECAUSE IT WAS. Even Oprah thought it too much to continue at that church. (She went there for a few years.) Before you insult me, which is one of your favorite hobbys, did you actually SEE the website before it was radically changed?? I did. He preached black liberation theology.
"Black theology is a form of liberation theology that has its center in the theme of oppression of black people by white people
Jesus is seen as a non-white, social liberator who focused on the emancipation of the poor and of the marginalized, and many parallel are made with the emancipation efforts of black people in the United States. Christ's message is interpreted as encouraging "black power" (Henry). His intrinsic nature and spiritual activity receive little or no attention. Some even deny his role as the atoning sacrifice for the world's sins and provider of eternal life (Shrine).
Salvation is freedom from the oppression and pertains to blacks in this life. Proponents of black theology are concerned specifically with the political and theological aspects of salvation more than the spiritual. In other words, salvation is physically liberation from white oppression, or "The white enemy" (Cone) rather than freedom from the sinful nature and acts of each individual person. Presenting heaven as a reward for following Christ is seen as an attempt to dissuade blacks from the goal of real liberation of their whole persons.


[edit] Church
Sounds racist to me and Obama acts clueless concerning what his church of 20 years is all about.

[quote=marilynk;3039534]And how many times I have been bashed for even hinting that someone said something that someone else posted? Apples to oranges then too I guess........
Oh wait, certain rules only apply to certain people on here.......my bad.

[quote=marilynk;3039534]And why don't you post an answer to the question I brought up about female surgeons....

[quote=kathytheshopper;3039528]I was referring to the post in #44 about Sex Ed. in school not working. Is that what you mean??? I did not post the post you have quoted here......I think that was USNAMom

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

[quote=kathytheshopper;3039543]How about beacuse it doesn't apply? Being a surgeon is a far cry from being the VP of the US. Just because you throw out two important jobs, doesn't mean that they can be compared. I feel like i have a very important job, and that it's pretty demading....but, at the end of the day, I'm not one of the leaders of the free world.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

[quote=allinaugust;3039544]Yes, I stand corrected and edited my post. Thanks

[quote=Kelliiii;3039545]You might think differently if that surgeon was operating on you or a loved one!!!

well, if you insist---
Female Drs: generally have a set schedule (with the exceptions being during residency, trauma surgeons, possibly cardiac surgeons), and even if they are called in for an emergency it generally doesn't last more than a few hours. The biggest majority of the time, female doctors (again see the exceptions), and any doctor for that matter, can leave in the middle of the shift if a personal crisis comes up. Leave policies are in place in every major hospital I have ever worked with just for that matter. Most MDs can take a sabbatical for personal reasons without jeapordizing their patients (or the country). Most MDs have more than one "back-up"/"on-call" person should they be unavailable.

Female VPs: Have a set schedule--but that can be changed at any time, depending on circumstances. If a VP is tapped to "fill-in" for the President, an emergency could last for days, weeks, months--or even YEARS. What is the personal leave policy for the vice-President? Could she just walk out of a G8 Summit or cabinet meeting if a personal crisis came up? Can she take a sabbatical w/o jeaporidizing the country? Who is her back-up/on-call person? OH WAIT a Minute! She is the back-up/oncall person.

So, yes, female Drs and female VPs are like comparing apples to oranges.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

[quote=marilynk;3039534

apples to oranges Kathy and you know it.[/QUOTE]

Why is it apples to oranges? A female surgeon on call, a female CEO of a major corporation, an attorney who has to work night and days to prepare for a trial -- I could go on and on -- say all these ladies had children (and the 17 year old pregnant). Why is that any different than being VP of the United States? As a matter of fact, I would think being the VP would definitely have its perks as far as child care, making sure your children are with you, being fed and taken care of much more than the surgeon, CEO, attorney and any other lady out there with stressful jobs.

You guys are just playing 'go fish' and see what can be dug up and complain about it. I would think the feminists on these boards would be dancing in the streets since there's a woman on the ballot who can do it all -- she can bring home the bacon, fry it up in the pan and do everything else too!! But, oh, wait, she's a Republican. It's not Democratic Palin -- it's Republican Palin.

You libs want to break the glass ceiling but you only want to break it if it's broken by a Democratic woman. Well, that didn't happen. If you actually cared about your cause of women's rights, you'd quit your bellyaching and at least commend Gov. Palin for getting the VP spot.

There are hundreds if not thousands of quaified VP candidates on the republican side. My problem with her is she isn't (IMO) qualified. Did he look at Dr.Rice, Senator Hutchinson, Senator Snowe, Senator Dole?? If not, why not?

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Ana
The Republicans have been putting lipstick on a pig for 8 years. Is a pitbull wearing lipstick an attempt to keep us from noticing the pig?

Yep, you are entirely correct--VP is going to afford a person the ways and means to not be in their child's life if they so choose.

I'm not playing "go fish". I want a woman on the ballot who is the right woman for the job! I don't want a token woman

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Why weren't the above chosen? Because they're old school. They're affiliated too close to President Bush. Why do you think Hilary wasn't chosen as the nominee for president for the Democrats? Because she's old school. She's old Washington. People are looking for something new, something that hasn't been in Washington for years. Gov. Palin is that person.

[quote=kathytheshopper;3039563]Do you even read what you type BEFORE you hit the submit button? Or better yet, do you read what you are commenting on? Unreal.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

Closed thread. Posts over 50. Please feel free to open a new one on this topic.

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Here are 2 republican governors: Linda Lingle of Hawaii and Jodi Rell of Connecticut. There are also republican female business leaders -- one being the past CEO of HP who has spoken highly of Senator McCain. IMO, literally dozens of more qualified republican women to choose from most of whom aren't Washington mainstays if that's what he wanted.

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Ana
The Republicans have been putting lipstick on a pig for 8 years. Is a pitbull wearing lipstick an attempt to keep us from noticing the pig?