Do you really think Hillary will vote for Obama on election day? I've watched her speaking for Obama, she really doesn't seem to have her heart into it. I can't blame her, it was a big slap in the face for Obama to choose Biden. I know she's a true democrat, but come election day , when you're the only one in there, and it's time to cast your vote????????????.
When you have only minor differences with the other candidates,
I think you really have to vote your heart, not always your party.

************************************************** ************************
Yes, I'm an Independent, Yes, I'm McCain/Palin, Yes, I've done my homework on all the candidates,
and Yes, I want what's best for America.

Was it a big slap in the face for McCain not to chose Mitt Romney as VP or Fred Thompson or that pastor guy?

I think that Hilary Clinton wants to do what is best for her country and while she may think that she was the best candidate for the Democratic ticket, the public did not agree. She is smart. She wants the country to go a different path than it is going now. I never would imagine that she would vote any other way except for the Democratic Ticket.

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GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

Hillary most certainly will not be voting for McCain. She'll vote for Obama.

HRC is a smart woman, far too smart to be taken in by McSame and Quaylin. She'll vote for Obama. Although she's not exactly in a state that's in any danger of going red.

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Reading is Fundamental.

Someone on here, I forget who, came out with a whole analogy of why she may NOT vote for Obama. I had not thought of it before that, actually.

I don't think she will vote for him, based on the analogy of that person. If I have time, I'll try to find it. I think it was WowItsDark maybe who posted it????

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Obama didn't choose HIllary because he didn't want 3 presidents in the White House, period, I can't say I blame him!

I believe also that Obama disrespected HRC by not at least vetting her for the VP slot. Don't know whether or not she would have accepted it anyway. BUT, like ALL thinking, intelligent, informed people who want a true change, and totally away from the debacle that was the last 8 year Presidential handling, she, I am 100% certain, will vote for Mr. Obama.

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"Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich


"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous

"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity

Have the courage to be yourself.

Yep. She will vote Obama. As much as she waned to be President she does not want our country to go backward.

The public DID agree, she won by popular vote.....unfortunately, that doesn't count. Obama won more delegates, but needed the help of superdelagates to cross the finish line ahead of Hillary. His candidacy was handed to him - not by voters but by Democratic big guns.

All HRC had to do was get those big guns on her side and she would have had the nomination. She would have needed supers to pass the finish line as well. Isn't it time to stop pretending that Obama somehow got the nomination unfairly? It's a dandy sound bite, but it's not true.

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Reading is Fundamental.

No question that Hillary is voting for Obama. She'll vote on the issues just as any thinking voter should. I would say more than anyone else in this country she has done her "homework on all the candidates" and "wants what’s best for America".

Well, I guess that's something we'll never know since voting is a private issue. Who knows how people will vote when they go behind the curtain.

If Hillary is thinking ahead of the next election, I'd say that no, she will not vote for Obama because if Obama wins, then she won't be able to run in the next election. However, if McCain wins, she'll be able to run (probably against Sarah Palin).

That would be interesting, wouldn't it?

I've had these same thoughts. You just never know. But I wouldn't bet any money on who she votes for-not that we will ever know of course.

HRC has stated over and over in public that she will be voting for Mr. Obama. I believe her. Just as I believe those of you who claim you will be voting for McCain. Or are you lying and once you "go behind the curtain" you will really be voting for Mr. Obama. Can't have it both ways...assured of your vote just because you say it is so but not her word because you don't want it be so......

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"Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich


"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous

"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity

Have the courage to be yourself.

Since it's a private thing and no one truly knows, I will put my opinion in for a write in - herself.

dl

Duh on me, I never thought of that!!!

It's the same sound bite that has been heard for the past what..8 years?

If the election board is still here for THAT one, I will NOT be posting or reading

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

I was thinking the same thing. It is really in her best interest if Obama doesn't win. Honestly, I think she'll be writing in Hillary Clinton.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

It is in not one person's best interest in this country if Obama doesn't win. Hillary said she is voting for Obama. But, I guess you all know HRC better than she knows herself.

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"Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich


"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous

"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity

Have the courage to be yourself.

And you actually believe what she says? Hilary has SAID a lot of things, most of which I don't believe.

You know when democrats lie? When they open their mouth!

Yes, I believe her, just like you believe McCain.

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"Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich


"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous

"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity

Have the courage to be yourself.

the republicans would recognize that since they taught everyone how.

__________________
GO NAVY WRESTLING!!BEAT ARMY!!!
RJB 3/18/60 - 5/22/04
We miss you, sweet brother
God Bless the USA!!!!! Praying for my Youngster son at United States Naval Academy, class of 2014!!

http://mylifeundertheabaya.blogspot.com/

I don't believe she will. I think Hillary wants Obama to lose. Why? So she can run in 2012. This woman and her ilk don't give one flying leap about the country or it's people. She's in it for herself. Promoting Obama goes against her desire for power. I actually love it. I dislike Obama and think he is bad for the country. So, if Hillary is against him, that's a good thing.

Just your opinion and the opinion of lots(not all) of Republicans. It seems the me me me people cant conceive of the concept of country or people first. Hillary has built her life on helping the middle class and working poor. She is not as selfish(though all of us are selfish to a certain extent) as to want our country to go backward for her own gain.


Democrats are a different sort(in general). We think more of others and want to help the disadvantaged and poor have a better life and a chance at "making it".

Personally I will never have an abortion but believe in choice.
I am not gay but believe gays should have all the rights of other Americans.
I don't have teens but believe we owe it to them to teach them how to avoid pregnancy(not just abstinence). Gov. Palin has a daily reminder of this.
I have wonderful health insurance but still will fight for the right of others to have insurance at a cost they can afford.
I am not a minority but I can understand(and see) how there is still racism in this country.

I believe all those things too. . .but I'm not a Democrat.

Here's an interesting piece:

Democrats talk about the different policies, positions,and priorities we'd see from the White House if Al Gore had been elected instead of George W. Bush. But members of the Green Party say that most Democratic and Republican politicians – including Gore and Bush –hold similar positions on major issues –and that's why we need a new party that gives power to “We the People” instead of powerful corporations. Which is true? Judge for yourself – and compare with Green positions:
DEMOCRAT vs. REPUBLICAN What's the difference? ?

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

It's ridiculous to say that Democrats think more of others than Republicans. Way to pat yourself on your noble back, though.

Yep, and you know what's sad? She probably thinks the Dems actaully do more then the Repubs when it comes to that sort of thing.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Whats sad is you don't believe the truth.

Show me the evidence.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

There have been several studies recently about why Republicans prefer to believe, for instance, that Saddam Hussein had WMD's even after hearing Pres. Bush say they didn't. .

Do Our Political Beliefs Have a Biological Basis? | Newsweek Health | Newsweek.com

Kevin Drum - Mother Jones Blog: The Backfire Effect

Edge: WHAT MAKES PEOPLE VOTE REPUBLICAN? By Jonathan Haidt

As for the above quote, if all the Democrats help the disadvantaged and poor as little as Joe Biden has, then the disadvantaged and poor are going to get poorer! According to his tax returns, Joe Biden has given a little over $3,000 total in the past 6 or 7 years to charities! I think some years it was as little as a couple hundred of dollars he gave to charity.

I was referring to her comment that the Dems help the disadvantaged and poor more.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

This was discussed in a previous post. I am not going to rehash it. Not everyone feels they must keep track and get tax credit for all their good work. But if you must rehash it then do a search to find the post. I am sure there are those here that would love to talk about it and turn it into another abortion or race post for you.

Oh I think anyone that makes that much money keeps track of their donations for their tax records. I don't but I don't itemize (don't make enough, don't have enough house payment interest).

What ARE you talking about? I haven't spoken of Joe Biden's lack of charitable giving in other posts. It has nothing to do with race or abortion. You were the one who brought up the fact that the democrats think more of others and want to help the disadvantaged and poor, and I brought up the fact that Joe Biden hasn't given to charity. I highly doubt someone of his tax bracket doesn't keep records for tax deduction purposes. And if by chance he doesn't keep records of his giving, then do we really want someone that ignorant in the White House as VP?

This is a great question! I think HRC is a loyal democrat and will vote for BO. No so sure about Bill Clinton, however!!!

Bill Clinton on The View strongly affirmed that he is, indeed, going to vote for Senator Obama. He said he personally knows and likes both candidates as people, but has the same policy alignments and Senator Obama. I believe him 100%.

__________________
"Well-Behaved Women SELDOM make history."Laurel Thatcher Ulrich


"Yesterday is but a vision, and tomorrow is only a dream. But today well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness, and every tomorrow a dream of hope." Anonymous

"Your candle does not lose it's light by lighting another candle" Generosity

Have the courage to be yourself.

I missed the prior thread, so I'm declaring a hijack. I'll call us back to topic at the end of this brief continuation of things off topic though.

I don't know where declining to take every advantage of the tax breaks means someone is ignorant.

I gives lots to charities. I don't claim nearly what I give because (1) it's a pain in the ass; (2) it's not worth the effort in a lot of cases and (3) if you end up having to release the information, people can make fun of it and use it as fodder.

I'm clearly older than most of the folks posting here, but I remember in the first run of Bill Clinton, there was a lot of fun made about his itemized charitable deductions. There was an itemized list of those material items submitted to charity, and on his list, there were briefs. Like in jockeys.

Oh god, the jokes were endless.

I personally stopped claiming all of my charitable contributions for a while. I have a healthy enough tax bracket where the greater contributions would have made some difference. But to me, the recordkeeping wasn't worth the deduction. Also, a larger deduction didn't make up for the fact that, if these forms were ever released, everyone but everyone would know everything about everything that I ever contributed.

Also, charitable contributions are an OK deduction, but they aren't that great. I'm fine with giving money to charities without getting the tax break. That doesn't mean that I'm ignorant. That just means that I have different priorities. I still gave to charities. I just didn't feel that I needed to take the tax credit for it. I was willing to forego the relatively small deduction in exchange for not having to itemize the information and not having to report if I donated my tight jeans.

So, I don't draw a conclusion from Biden's charitable spending. Yes, if he is contributing but not deducting, he is contributing to the tax base of this country more than he has to. You might call it ignorant; I would say that it is smart.

If you do say that you say those folks who itemize everything are super-duper intelligent, keep this in mind. You'll have to put that stamp on Clinton, who apparently itemized his tighty whiteys (not that there is anything wrong with that) as well as those folks who are manipulating the tax system to the furtherest degree possible. Hello, Enron.

For me, I said, well, the guy is earning less than he would in the private sector as a lobbyist, which he clearly could have been. I don't expect whopping dollars from him.

NOW, back to the actual topic.

Hillary's voting for Obama. Bill Clinton's voting for Obama. They are public servants. Bill served, Hillary tried to serve as President and still serves as Senator, because they believe in the ideals of the Democratic party.

Turn it around. GWB and McCain apparently despise each other. They are hardly ever seen in public together. Will GWB vote for McCain? You bet your ass. Do you think that McCain voted for Bush in the last election. You bet your ass.

And if you question the latter answer, regarding whether McCain voted for Bush, you better question some more things, like whether you think he is willing to swallow his pride and vote for the candidate of his party.

And if you can see him doing it, you should be able to see Hillary Clinton doing it.

And if you can't, you have a problem. And thankfully, it's yours.

Yeah. . .itemizing deductions is a pain! That's pretty funny about Clinton's briefs though. . .I've never heard that. So just how much do you get to deduct for second hand briefs?

The point in this thread that I'm questioning is the idea that the Democratic Party has been the touchy-feely, do-good party for the poor and disadvantaged. Historically that just isn't true. I found this and I know it is from the National Black Republican Association, but what it says is true. I'm just curious what gives people the idea that it's not.

Why Martin Luther King, Jr. was a Republican
National Black Republican Association - DYK-Why MLK was a Republican

__________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

The difference is...I donate tons of my stockpile, I'm too lazy to get rcpts. or itemize it, yes I'm in the 28% & it would probably benefit me, but I just never got in the habit. Biden on the other hand, I'm sure pays others to handle his taxes. If he wrote out a flat check to donations, it would not be an issue at all to include that in his tax statement.

Then there's Obama..with his ONE percent donation. He says nobody got rich under Bush's plans, but his wealth all accumulated under hte Bush years.

But what's the difference? You aren't declaring deductions, because you are "too lazy." In other words, the deduction wasn't worth the trouble it took to declare it.

Why is it so hard to think that it was any different for Biden?

I'm going to say straight out, it's worse when you pay someone. Just close your eyes, and think about that tax advisor, who asks you all those questions about what you took and when, and what are your receipts.

Actually, it's even more of a pain when you pay someone to do your taxes than when you do them yourselves. At least from personal experience, any way.

You aren't in the "habit" of keeping track. Why would you suddenly become in the "habit" because someone else is reporting your income?

I'm guessing that you aren't saying that he didn't make charitable contributions unless he wrote a check. You didn't, right? I didn't anyway.

This whole thing is just bull****.

He's paying taxes on the income he earned. The fact that he probably could have but didn't declare as much in charitable income is really beside the point. If you are all about paying taxes on earned income, I think that you'd embrace the fact that he was conservative in his deductions.

If I were writing a straight check it would not be a "lazy" issue any longer, and I'd have a clear cut copy of my donation.

It's much more logical to assume nothing was donated when nothing was reported rather than "he just didn't report it".

No it isn't different. I don't get why you think that it is.

You said that you "donate tons of my stockpile, I'm too lazy to get rcpts. or itemize it, yes I'm in the 28% & it would probably benefit me, but I just never got in the habit."

I'm in a higher tax bracket, and it probably would benefit me, but I never got in the habit either. What is the difference between us? It's the same tax break whether you are in the lower tax bracket or the higher tax bracket. The deduction remains the same. The incentive remains the same. You can deduct your charitable contributions if you itemize. I assume you itemize. If you do, you have the same incentive at 28 percent as you would at a higher percent. The tax consequences are the exact same.

Why would you think that you are different because you " donate tons of my stockpile, I'm too lazy to get rcpts. or itemize it, yes I'm in the 28% & it would probably benefit me, but I just never got in the habit." I don't know why you think that it is understandable for you, and not for Biden?

Incidentally, what is Palin's charitable contributions? Just asking. Don't know the answer.

I do know that she used a government "per diem" allowance to charge the state for more than 300 nights spent at home and spent another $43,490 on travel for her children and husband.

I suppose someone might think it is worse that someone didn't take full advantage of tax deductions, or even that some wasn't giving as much as they could have been.

I personally think that we should pay more attention to the fact of someone bleeding the public treasury for trips to convenience her family, than we should be paying attention to whether someone didn't claim as much as they could have, or even whether someone didn't give as much as they should have.

For my purposes, someone taking too much is worse than some giving too little, even when you take all of the other value judgments out of it.

But let's be serious. Do you really ****ing care? Are you going to vote based on whether Biden made enough charitable contributions? Or whether Palin took too many trips on the public dime.

I'm willing to meet you on these issues. I just think that we are not engaging on the important issues. But so be it. If this is what matters to you, I'm willing to talk about them.

Just don't ever accuse me or mine of discussing trivialities. Because you are the ones who asked for this fight. Not me.