**warning** don't read this if you don't want to know what the market is doing right now...

The Dow has dropped -492.14 points today and is now under 10000 (9833.24 as of 11:54 am) for the first time in 4 years.

Rasmussen Reports: The most comprehensive public opinion coverage ever provided for a presidential election.

Rasmussen Consumer Index

Consumer Confidence Declines Following Passage of Bailout Bill
Monday, October 06, 2008

Consumer and investor confidence have both fallen since Congressional approval of the economic bailout legislation.

The Rasmussen Consumer Index, which measures economic confidence on a daily basis, fell three points on Monday to 68.5. This is the first update based entirely on interviews conducted after Congress passed the federal bailout legislation Friday. The Index has fallen three points since that legislation was passed, and is down fourteen points from last month.

Just 8% of Americans rate the economy good or excellent, while 62% rate it as poor. While 11% of men give the economy positive ratings, just 7% of women agree. Sixty-five percent (65%) of women and 58% of men give the economy a poor rating.

The Rasmussen Investor Index shows a similar trend, with investor confidence down two points on Monday since the bailout was approved. At 75.2, the Investor Index is down nineteen points from a month ago. Among investors, 10% rate the economy good or excellent, while 57% rate it as poor.

At the time the bailout was passed by Congress, just 30% of voters favored the legislation and 45% were opposed.

Full month numbers released today show that consumer confidence is down for September. The Rasmussen Consumer Index for the full month of September was at 78.3, down from 79.7 in August. This is the seventh straight month the Index has been below 80. Previously, it had never fallen that low in any month since the Index was established in October 2001.

The decline in confidence for September contradicts the results released yesterday by the Conference Board, but the difference is primarily one of timing. Conference Board data was based upon responses from earlier in the month and did not capture data from the last week or so of the month.

The Rasmussen Investor Index for the full month of September finished at 88.8, down four from 93.0 in August.

The Rasmussen Consumer Index and Investor Index are derived from nightly telephone surveys of 500 adults and reported on a three-day rolling average basis. The baseline for the Index was established at 100.0 in October 2001. Readings above 100.0 indicate that confidence is higher than in the baseline month. Detailed supplemental information is available for Premium Members. Historical data for the Consumer and Investor indexes as well as attitudes about the economy and personal finances are also available to Premium Members.

The Rasmussen Consumer Index reached its highest level ever at 127.0 on January 6, 2004. The all-time low was reached on June 10, 2008 at 66.2.

The Rasmussen Investor Index reached its highest level ever at 150.9 on January 7, 2004. The lowest level ever measured was 73.0 on October 2, 2008.

The baseline for the Rasmussen Consumer Index was established at 100.0 in October 2001. The current reading of 68.5 that overall levels of economic confidence are lower today than the confidence level in the aftermath of the 9-11 terrorist attacks.

Rasmussen Reports is an electronic publishing firm specializing in the collection, publication, and distribution of public opinion polling information.

The Rasmussen Reports ElectionEdge™ Premium Service for Election 2008 offers the most comprehensive public opinion coverage ever provided for a Presidential election.

Scott Rasmussen, president of Rasmussen Reports, has been an independent pollster for more than a decade.

Can we please get out of this goverment regulation game and get back to free market economics where crappy companies get weeded out and the market shakes out the losers and the cheats?!

__________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Neel Kashkari (35 years old) is suppose to be point man overseeing the $700 billion financial bailout

Deal Journal - WSJ.com : Meet Neel Kashkari: The Man With the $700 Billion Wallet


ETA: Dow -707 at 2:35

Amazing how people seem to forget how bad it was in 1987 and it bounced back. All it will take is for people to invest again and it will start rising. But NO every idiot is pulling out all at once and it keeps going lower and lower.

Second off if the greedy.......I repeat.........GREEDY corps would stop pulling out of everything they invested in to bottom out the market only to buy it back up at a bargin basement price then we would be doing good. I myself blame it all on the ignorant President that the moronical population voted in ..........I never voted for the idiot so I have the right to complain when he messes up America. Wow what 8 years as the president can do for a country..............Clinton had a surplus and this ignorant fool has us going into colapase.

Don't forget the Democratic Congress. There is plenty of blame to go around for this, but a lot of this started with the change to the CRA under Clinton.

__________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Please everyone try to stop blaming Clinton or Bush the true most important thing right now is our beautiful country is in a big horrible sad sad mess. Lets all pray that perhaps whomever comes into power and given time, we will see the light at the end of the tunnel. Too many hands of all parties were invloved one way or another, there is nothing we can do now , but truly pray that this wonderful free nation and beautiful country will rebound and make us all to be proud to be American. Peace. Catherine

Shoot, what's 700 billion? And how long before another bail out in the billions? Shoot. I didn't think it would do much except cost more money the government doesn't have and I don't really have anymore. I feel like my fingernails are being bled with pliers, they just keep at it and at it since it's not hurting them. Matter of fact, it's making them feel good. That has to be the reason they passed this, to make themselves feel good. Let's pass the pliers around.

Congress went against what the majority taxpayers wanted. Shoot, nothing new.


dl

Today was just scary.

I was going to post how the economic crises in the US will affect my family, because I think we are fairly emblematic of how this economic downturn is affecting even those families who are solidly middle-class. But frankly, it was too depressing on the one hand, because it makes me a little sick that our lives are so dependent on things that seem out of my control and which won't be quickly fixed, and yet not depressing enough on the other, because I think that my family and my parents and my siblings' families are better equipped to ride this out than most.

All I will say on the topic of the impact on my family, then, is that it feels like a house of cards right now.

Tonight, my anger is focused on those whose greediness helped get us here. I have two people in mind. One is Tom Petters. He is a Minnesota entrepreneur who ran Petters Holding Company, whose investments backed up Fingerhut, Polaroid, and Sun Country Airlines. He has just been indicted for running what looks to be a huge Ponzi scheme that might involve up to $3 billion. Petters Is Arrested in Fund Fraud Case - WSJ.com

Sun Country filed for Chapter 11 today.

Petters was a bank robber in a three-piece suit. The one bright spot in the whole story about Petters is how fast the different governmental agencies acted on this. I'm told that, from the time of the initial tip to authorities to the time of his arrest, was only 24 days. That is surely good news.

Second is Raymond Lamb. He was also featured recently in the Wall Street Journal. Failed Lender Played Regulatory Angles - WSJ.com Unlike what Petters did, it isn't clear to me that Lamb did anything that will result in him losing his personal assets or face criminal prosecution. What killed me about this article was that it didn't appear that he would ever face any real repercussions for his wild ways, and then this last statement:

Looks like his retirement is secure. Wish that I could say the same for people in the position of my mom and dad, who are talking about having to liquidate assets because of people like Ray Lamb and the damage that they caused. But at least my folks have assets to liquidate, which make them fortunate in an unfortunate time.

DB - I am sorry you are feeling so unsettled today. I expect that if you are, many, many, many more people are going to be as well.

As far as Ponzi schemes, that is what I believe the whole housing is (was). My heart goes out to those who purchased and got stuck.

My, you sure do like to throw around the insults, don't you??? I see this as an opportunity, and as you stated, we invested. Buy low and sell high. Now is the PERFECT time to buy.

Secondly, I voted for the current President, and don't consider myself a moron. And, just because someone voted for Bush doesn't mean they don't have the right to complain as well. As far as I'm concerned, the only ones who shouldn't be complaining are the ones who didn't take the time to vote at all.

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

Here is an excellent Glen Beck interview from tonight 10/06 (1 hour) with Peter Schiff and others that explains what we might be facing in the next couple of months/years.

inflationary depression

Ron Paul Archives Glenn Beck HLN interviews Schiff, Velshi, Moore 10/06/08

Do I agee with you? You betcha, doggonit. (wink, wink)

I think that the only way that you can look at this market, and see it as an opportunity to make a killing instead of a disaster is that you saw this coming, and sheltered your money early, which is a very small margin of investors, or you invested late and are gambling on an upswing, or you have a lot of money, so you can gamble without feeling threatened, or you really have no money at all in the market, but are willing to talk about it.

I do have money in this market. It's taking a beating. I feel threatened. I wonder about putting more into the market or pulling out my investments entirely. I've played it optimistically for at many months now, despite all economic indicators. I keep telling myself that I'd be a fool to pull out now when the market is low. Tomorrow must be better.

But it hasn't turned around.

I suspect tomorrow will be better than today. But I'm not very confident in the day after tomorrow.

Between the two of us, it seems we will survive no matter what. But we are really lucky to be in a position to even care immediately in tomorrow's returns. Most people don't have the money to invest. In my life, most people don't have the money to even care whether they might make a killing. They do care that their job is going away.

Personally, I think that the markets will have a rebound tomorrow, but not enough to make me feel confident about my long term investments.

As far as you are or not not a moron for supporting Bush, I don't care on this topic. I do think that your choice was misguided as best.

Were you a moron?

I wouldn't say "moron." Unrealistically optimistic, I would say. I don't even want to get into the reasons he was a bad choice. Never a choice that I would make.

But you voted for him. Embrace your choice. Or explain it.

My retirement is tanking and I'm scared. I resent the amount of money being invested in pet projects, which I do think Iraq was. It was Bush's pet project. Whether you agree that the incredible investment of money in Iraq is worth it or not, you must accept that the decision to start this war was Bush's.

Think what that money would have matter if it was invested into our infrastructure.

Instead Bush got a hair up his ass, because he thought his dad was a target, and started seeing Martians were there were none, and we got the war in Iraq.

You see it all differently. Fine. But I remember the whole justification of "weapons of mass destruction." How did that work for you, hmm?

You might have supported Bush. I think it was a bad choice, but I'm sure it was a choice that you made based on your priorities.

Today, I am completely and wholly scared. I remember being optimistic about my future. That would be under Clinton. Bush, well there is that war thing. That billion and billion of dollars war thing. That loss of lives war thing.

We are on shaky ground.

And with every election, I become more scared. First time I voted, I thought the world would end if I didn't prevail. I was a kid with a kid's emotions.

For me, this election scares me as an adult, and a very middle aged verging on retirement adult.

Edit: I hadn't intended to post this. I hit the wrong button. Be that what it may, I stand behind my thoughts, as rambling as they are.

That was soooo good. I don't want to scare anybody too much but the other board I post at, has quite a few members with Phd's in encon., and they're stockpiling and warning others to start. Inflation is going to get crazy unless we get some common sense going here from somebody. . .anybody.

This is the signature line of many posters there:

Emergency Preparations are the most important thing you can be doing for yourself and your family right now.



ETA: Dannyboy. . .if you haven't watched the Beck piece, watch it. I feel for you. It's not even about Dems or Repubs at this point. . .neither of them get it. I imagine you are talking about your IRA's and those can't just be pulled out without a penalty. BUT the problem isn't if the stockmarket can turn around and you start seeing a gain as opposed to the losses in the market now, the REAL danger is going to be inflation. It is going to eat away any gains. . .and it sounds like it could be massive inflation.

__________________
"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

No, didn't exactly see this coming, but, you can't expect a market to keep going up, up , up....kind of like the housing market. I think everyone knew that bubble would burst, and started doing so back in late 2005, early 2006.

I definitely DO have money in this market. I'm quite diversified, and thankfully I have time to ride this out. I do feel for people who don't have the time to ride this out. I have to say, my family and I made these investments knowing whole heartedly that they are just that, investments....they are not guaranteed. If we wanted guarantees, I guess we would have bought savings bonds....oh wait, we DID!!! Investing carries risks, that has to be accepted.


I think this speaks volumes. If everyone would have just put away $10 a week, $5 a week, $1 a week...... even 3 years ago, they would have some money in savings, and maybe not feeling so pinched right now??? DH and I began putting away money when we thought we had NO EXTRA MONEY to put away. But, you know??? People always seem to find money for the things they want...... cell phone, cable TV, cigarettes, lattes, on and on. Where there is a will, there is a way. I really believe it's about choices. I strongly urge everyone that reads this to start by putting away SOMETHING....ANYTHING, even if it's a dollar week. Buy one less 12pk of soda, buy cheaper bread......your future is in your hands, grab it and steer it on a straight and steady course. I like the line from Titanic where the guy says "I make my own luck".


I don't see how you can make judgements about my reasons for voting for Pres. Bush when I haven't even given any, but, whatever.



I have resolved to the fact that the election will fall where it may, and life will go on. If McCain is elected, so be it. If Obama is elected, so be it. There is very little that I can do, other than vote, to change things. I'm focusing on myself and my family, and not relying on some promise by a politician to keep my life running. I suggest the same to everyone. NO matter who gets elected, we as individuals would do best to look after our own interests, and protect ourselves. Don't rely on your government.

__________________
Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.