They went for the low blow. Just seen an ad with the Rev. Wright.

Why is that a low blow????....He was his minister for 20yrs....He took up for Jeremiah Wright and then he lied and said he had never heard things like this......Its just a fact....Here is a video of him praising him.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSrNsBw2oes
Sherri

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"It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

How does this prove that Senator Obama 'heard things like this'? How is it a fact? Just trying to understand how you know more than most.

Please....come on...he set under him for 20 yrs and you think he didnt hear rheotric like this????? If you believe that I have some swamp land in florida I'll sell ya........He heard what he said and he agreed with it....or why would he have stayed 20 yrs...If my pastor spoke like this one time...I would never go back...Sherri

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"It isn't that liberals are ignorant, it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan

Just the facts please. This election is way too important for people to assume. You may keep your swamp land in Florida. I will base my vote on the facts and only the facts.

By the way, is there a reason you didn't want to defend your original statement?

How does this prove that Senator Obama 'heard things like this'? How is it a fact? Just trying to understand how you know more than most.

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If attending this type of church (black liberation theology) for 20 yrs doesn't say something about him... I don't know what does.
Do you really think if the shoe was on the other foot the dems wouldn't put out the same ad against McCain.

As usual, the Dems this the Dems that....No concrete answers to anything.

Ummm NO. Did he post the one with Palin and the witch doctor....Um No

Uh. . . .maybe because Obama admitted it on March 14th, 2008!?

YouTube - Obama lies, tells the truth, then lies some more

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Uh. . . Obama lies, "I didn't hear anything. Wright is my mentor and friend.". . .. Oh wait! "I did hear controversial statements". . .Oh wait. . . ." I denounce anything I might have heard him say that may have been seen as contoversial over those 20yrs." Hey Jeremiah, don't let the door slam you in the ass on your way out! Sorry I had to through you under the bus for political aspirations.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

The shoe is on the other foot. There are no attack ads out about McCain's Hitler loving Paster Hagee nor Palin's crazy witch doctor.

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"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God? " ~Epicurus

Frankly, I just don't have a problem in the world with Rev. Wright. McCain had forbidden the 527s to use Wright in any advertising.

I guess it shows that McCain is unable to command his own party.

"But McCain has no control over state parties or outside groups."
Political Radar: New Wright Ad Attacks Obama in Battlegrounds

McCain is now the head of the RNC. What it shows is that they are not going to follow him. I have also read that the socially conservative wing of the party is jockeying to control the party.

OK Obama admitted hearing controversial things while in the Church. I am trying to make a point and nobody seems to get it. People should not just go along with the crowd by saying "I heard this in Starbucks today - or I was in line at the grocery and I heard this without backing up their story.

You shouldn't go around saying "he is scary" or "he is a socialist" or whatever and not know why you are saying these things.

That's funny. You know, I've been trying to say this for quite some time, yet, it seems when I would post something to try and get to the bottom of it, I was blasted with "I'm disappointed in you" "you got that from faux news" etc. ,etc. That is it EXACTLY jndhoyt...... know what you are defending or chastising. Don't just take someone's word for something.

I think we've pretty much all made up our minds, those of us that are posting, at least, so I'm out of here. No matter which way it goes, I am in support of helping this country and getting her moving to prosperity again.

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Doing the right thing isn't always the same as doing the easy thing.

I agree with that, but it applies both ways. Don't go around saying I heard he never heard anything controversial if it's not true.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

And where did I say he never heard anything controversial! Yes it goes both ways but please stick with the facts.

You said:

I don't know any other way to interpret that. I gave you the proof of where he admits that he "heard things like that". Why do you think people say he lied? Not just because they heard it somewhere, but because of what Obama himself has said.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Amen sister!

No matter which way it goes, I'm also committed to helping it get back on track again. I hope that come the 5th we all realize that it order to "turn the ship" it is not only going to be a slow process, but it is about to take a nation, not just one side of the table. It's not going to be a Right of Left thing, and we can't just blame one party or another, we must take responsiblity as citizens and make our own change.

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

Well then you need to be more careful about interpreting. Like I said I wanted the person saying "it's just a fact" to prove what they were saying. It didn't matter whether it was on this particular subject or another - I was making a point of justifying what was being said.

Yes you gave particular information regarding this subject - the person I was talking to did not.

Fair enough.

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"No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?"
- George Orwell Animal Farm

Some things are just common sense: Obama was a member of the church for 20 years (give or take) ergo he probably heard the pastor say some pretty interesting things. Unless of course, he was absent much of the time, and absent during every inflammatory sermon. And if he was there, yet didn't understand or hear what was being said, then that says something about either his attention span, or his commitment to the church.

It's one thing to have a preacher endorse you in your bid for public office--without you having been a member of the flock. It's entirely another to attend and be a regular member of a church where radical statements and beliefs are espoused by the Pastor. Is that all Pastor Wright preached on? I would assume not, because most preachers vary their subjects--but I can tell you this from close personal experience of having been raised by two preachers: All preachers have one or two subjects that are near and dear to their heart. They will often preach on the same subject matter because it is so near and dear, and they are well versed in the subject.
The old adage if it walks, acts and quacks like a duck....

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Please don't use the common sense with the issue I am trying to make. Like I said I am tired of people saying on these boards "this is just fact" or because so and so said so.

End of subject.

I really think Rev. Wright says what he means and isn't going to back down on his view point just to make other people happy. I think he's pretty consistent in his sermons.
I don't agree with him, but I think he tells it like he sees it, and I feel he knows the real Obama.

But he does say about Obama:

Wright suggested that Obama was insincere in distancing himself from his pastor. "He didn't distance himself," Wright announced.
"He had to distance himself, because he's a politician, from what the media was saying I had said, which was anti-American."

Explaining further, Wright said friends had written to him and said, "We both know that if Senator Obama did not say what he said, he would never get elected.
" The minister continued: "Politicians say what they say and do what they do based on electability, based on sound bites, based on polls."


Could Rev. Spell Doom for Obama? - Rough Sketch

By the way, anyone know where McCain goes to church? Anyone? Anyone? I never see anything about him going to any church. Ever. Hmmph.

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Reading is Fundamental.

I do. It's important to me.

X

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Then Jesus said, "Come to me, all of you who are weary and carry heavy burdens, and I will give you rest." Matthew 11:28

everything I found through google says he's Episcopalain. But, you're correct I've not seen anything about him attending church or any photo ops of he and Cindy attending church. Don't know if that's a good thing or a bad thing...or just one of "those things".

And The Episcopal Church is a pretty non-controversial church....wait a minute! Don't they allow women in the priesthood??

Holy Crap! They do allow women in the priesthood!! In fact their presiding bishop is a woman!
Well, that makes them at least equal opportunist in allowing woman to preside!

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Actually, he was baptised Episcopalian, but attends a Baptist church, according to this report.

Bloomberg.com: Politics

I guess this means that McCain doesn't actually belong to any church. I wonder how many of his followers would be interested in that. It only matters if people chose to make something of Obama's religion -- which they are.

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Reading is Fundamental.

so, was he Baptised or Christened Episcopalian? Some churches don't make a distintion, but other's do. So, if he was "just" Christened as a wee babe, then that (to me) doesn't mean he's necessarily Episcopalian....

Regardless, of what religion he professes--as long as he doesn't say he sat in a church for 20 years and didn't hear what was being talked about.....

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

they are making an issue of his association with the preacher and the things hies preacher said. he went to the church for twenty years, he had to hear it, and become influeneced by that.

I understand, though I don't agree that he had to be influenced by it.

Now I want to know what McCain's been listening to in church. Seems fair, doesn't it?

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Reading is Fundamental.

Palin belongs to a Pentecostal church right?

I can't help but wonder if they're anything like the Pentecostals around here?

Here they preach that Catholics aren't "real Christians" and I've even heard them refer to the Pope as the "anti-christ".

I am NOT saying that Palin shares these views, or that all Pentecostal churches believe the same thing. I only know what I see around here.

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Once the game is over, the king and the pawn go back in the same box.

Just something I've observed in my line of work: The only lawyers we ever hear about are the scum sucking ambulance chasers--not the ones who do their job and don't get their names flashed all over every billboard, back of the phone book or newspaper insert. The only doctors we ever hear about are the ones who either coddle work comp claimants to the point of it being obscene or those who are fair and provide objective medical findings. The only work comp claimants you hear about are the ones who don't want to work anyway, and are trying to get something for nothing (generally a huge settlement for a minor, like a broke finger, injury).

My point is: You're not going to hear about the run of the mill preachers who go about their way, just doing their job or their calling. You hear about the radicals, the sheep in wool's clothing, the "Jim Jones" type, etc.

I'm sure that should you truly want to know, the preacher/pastor could provide copies of his notes from his sermons if asked. Maybe even a podcast or videotape.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

You're comparing Wright to a "Jim Jones" type?

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Reading is Fundamental.

Fair? That's a real good one coming from you at long last. Most poeple on this election board are fair, talk about fair, know what fair means. You have not up to this point. Maybe there is hope?

dl

*SIGH*
no, if you thoroughly read my post it also says RADICALS--which I firmly believe the good Reverend Wright to be. To my knowledge, we've gone a long time without a Jim Jones, David Koresh, etc. Probably the closest would be Warren Jeffs and the FLDS.

You're spoiling for an argument it appears---pick it with someone else.

My point was (in simple words)--You hear about the ones who talk the loudest, are the showiest/flashiest, or preach different ideas(from the norm--you know, a radical?), or do something stupid (like use all the church's money for hookers and blow) or are the cult like leaders.
You don't hear about the average preacher/priest/reverend/pastor who just runs the church, preaches, provides counsel to those who seek it--you know the average norm.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Maybe that's the problem with society as a whole--Few people use common sense.

But if you don't want to use yours, then by all means....go ahead.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

I understood just fine with your first post. And there is alot of merit in what you said. The media doesn't want to discuss or feature regular, good, doing the right thing day to day people, be they pastors, doctors, laborers, etc. Partly because the public wants the dirt. Each hand feeds the other and it's a sad commentary on our society how this plays out with what we get, and what we don't get.

dl

Grow up and move on to your next victim. Since you clearly did not understand - or want to understand - what my original comments regarded then you should refrain from interpreting my intent.

I believe Marilyn has appointed herself the board shrink.

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Reading is Fundamental.

bless your heart! I understand what you meant. To recap: You want people to provide objective findings to support a person's opinion. You want to know what they are basing their opinions on--unfortunately, an opinion sometimes is not based on anything but personal observations, gut feelings, or *gasp* common sense!

It boggles the mind for anyone to proclaim that Obama didn't ever hear radical statements from Rev. Wright. COMMON SENSE tells you that if he sat in a pew for 20 years he had to have heard at least some of it. Now, what he did upon hearing it is the true measure of his character.

However, if he did sit in the pew for 20 years and never heard any of it---then that also speaks volumes of his character as well.

Oh and truble---I don't think I'm a shrink, I have appointed myself anything of any board. You, on the other hand have earned every badge of honor/label you've received on the boards. I've even gone so far as to defend you before. I defended you because I thought you were simply misunderstood by many....I see I was wrong.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Getting a little silly don't you think? I NEVER said that Obama didn't hear the statements. Like I said, you clearly do not understand and I will leave it at that. If you wish to continue this silly conversation then sobeit - you will do it all by yourself.

yep, ok, whateeevvver you say m'dear.

Prove to me that Obama DID NOT hear anything that Rev.Wright said. Facts please, just the facts.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

You're right truble.

This is getting to be like gum on your shoe - just can't get rid of it.

LOL....little goo b gone or WD40 will take care of that gum.

To the best of my knowledge, this is the first time I've every responded to you or anything you have posted--unless of course, you have another ID that I've responded to. Hmmmmmmmmm.....

Whatever, sweetie. None of this personal. When you take it that way, maybe you're spending too much time on the internet.

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

Judging from personal experience, I can say that sitting in a pew for 20 years listening to a preacher definitely has an impact on your thinking. From the time I was little until I went off to college, I was in a church that was very close-minded. We were taught that basically anything fun was wrong -- no dancing, no movies, no rock n roll music, no 'close contact' with boys, and on and on. After you listen to that stuff for so long, you believe it. Finally after going away to college, I realized that what I had been taught all those years was just legalism, plain and simple. It was one man's beliefs and he was forcing them on the entire church.

There is no way Obama sat under Rev. Wright's preaching for 20 years and it didn't have an influence on him and the way he thought. No way! And Obama is lying when he says he didn't hear any of the racial and radical stuff Rev. Wright preached. He's lying, plain and simple. You just can't sit and listen to a man in the pulpit for 20 years and not have it influence you.

You can listen to a man in the pulpit for 20 years and not have it influence you. What about a gay person....They go to church, believe in God. Im sure when he/she started preaching about being gay they just turn the volume down. Millions of people go to church and dont agree with the head of the church on certain things. One of BFF is catholic, she drinks, smokes, has taken the pill since she been a teenager, live with her husband before she married etc etc etc......

I would have gone with the gum in the hair analogy. The only way to really get rid of it is to cut it out....

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

Then obviously you haven't read "Hints from Heloise"--if you put a little peanut butter on it, the gum will come out without having to cut the hair.

You guys are really too funny.


If I so offend, and I so piss you off or irritate you, then why not put me on ignore? You don't have to read my posts unless you want to. I've never understood pissing and moaning about how a poster irritates you but yet you don't put them on ignore. It's so easy!

I know why you don't---you like the argument. You like the back and forth. You live for it---or you'd be able to ignore me!

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

1. It takes a lot more than some posts to offend me. I thought you knew me better than that Marilyn!

2. My post wasn't direct at a particular person. The "cut it out" was really more of a universal comment...

3. Dude. I had no idea about the peanut butter thing. Thanks! That is actually kind of cool! I'm sure I will use that one day....

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I'm the kind of woman when my feet hit the floor in each morning, the devil says "Oh crap, she's up."

I'm sorry--I should have been clearer: the whole 'ignore' portion was directed to the general audience, not directly at you.

Yes, the peanut butter really works: We had just gotten the kids' hair cut, when oldes DS thought it would be cute to put gum in his baby brother's hair (3.5 and 2 y/o). We glopped on the peanut butter, let it set, then combed the gum out. Washed his hair and the gum was all gone....pretty flipping amazing!

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Mental that one, I'm telling you. ---Ron Weasley, "Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets"

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